Shoutout exchanges or the lack thereof (ie...why don't artists want to help each other out and get famous at the same time?)

[jonufele]

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[Silerna]

It takes ALOT patience I guess. Promoting my comic never really worked out for me so far.

[Kayke]

I think it has to come from a place of genuinely wanting to share someone else's work. Like I have people on twitter/tumblr who will retweet/reblog my work and I retweet/reblog other people's work all the time... but I have never seen a 'let's all shout out each other' thing working.

It's been my experience that if you just keep putting your work out there on social media, people will share it. Being friendly helps too, of course.

(also, instagram doesn't really feel like a good place for shout outs and stuff since you can't post links)

[chacsan]

It feels wrong to promote a comic just because the creator promoted yours, and likewise you shouldn't promote someone and expect them to promote you in return. You promote something because you like it. I think it's very important for creators to support each other, and I feel like we are doing that already, at least in my circle.

You just gotta find people with kind of a similar comic to yours (in style, theme, genre), read their comic, promote their comic, and be nice to the creator, and then if you're lucky they might have a look at your comic and if they like it they might promote it. If not? Well at least you found a new comic you like and I'm sure you've made the creator very happy with your support! : D But don't ask a 'popular' artist to promote you when you've barely (or never) talked.

Spreading negativity by saying things like "why doesn't anyone promote my comic?" is actually one of the worst things you can do; it only brews more negativity. But if you're positive and supportive people will like you and want to help you! c:

[Dranif]

Pretty much what @CyndiFoster and @spudfuzz said.
Artists (readers even) would only really want to share if they like what they see, and really only are willing to do shoutout exchanges if they know the other creator well enough. Also, there are plenty of artists on Twitter (myself included) who often share/RT the comic updates of other creators they like.

So it's not a fear of competing, or a fear of getting your fans stolen by someone with better or less talent than you. If things were like that, why would anyone bother uploading webcomics (and any form of media, really) ?

Yeah sure, I haven't had much luck at promoting myself yet, but that's only because I'm still relatively new to this in comparison to those who took years to build a community.

Patience, buddy. Patience is essential to the path towards greatness.

[stevemyers773]

Actually I've done all of this...and it still falters. I've promoted other artists every chance I can, try to do a regular Shoutout Saturday feature on my IG for other people trying to make it. The shoutout never really comes back unless it's agreed upon before hand, and like I said, that's been very very rare... which is all fine, and not why I do the shoutouts. But the mindset of it all got me wondering...'why? Why won't artists shake hands with each other more often and say, yeah, I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine!'

[stevemyers773]

Self promotion is very very exhausting...I feel like I spend maybe 30 mins to an hour minimum on it every day when i should be drawing/getting better.

[stevemyers773]

I've also had success more on IG than anywhere as far as my own promotion....when i promote someone I like I usually just screen shot their page w/ their username and then tag them in the post so people can click straight to it..wont work for web pages, I wish it did though, but works for IG accounts.

Also, to be clear, although it IS very frustrating trying to get my own stuff out there, i'm not trying to be negative or bag on artists for not sharing my stuff...I'm more curious why this isn't more of a thing and why people don't want to cross promote more often with each other. So I don't want it to seem like I'm expecting the world on a platter and anyone who doesn't deliver is dead to me or something

[keii4ii]

'why? Why won't artists shake hands with each other more often and say, yeah, I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine!'

To be honest, if anyone offered to promote my comic under the condition that I promote them back, that would make me feel used and devalued. I wouldn't want anyone to promote my work for any reason other than "I really like this, and it deserves more exposure." Between two extremes, A) getting no shoutouts and B) only getting 'agreed upon' shoutouts, I would choose A).

And even as a reader, if a creator I follow keeps spamming cross promo, I might stop following them out of annoyance. I want to see creators helping each other with no strings attached. And we DO have that going on around the community!

[stevemyers773]

I'm not sure I understand how this works, could you elaborate?

[sophiekaldinski]

Kinda my thoughts. I would not want to promote an artists work unless I like it personally. It would feel wrong for me to promote a comic that isn´t up my lane.
So promote me, I promote you feels kind of weird, especially when artists already promote things they like by drawing fan-art for example.

[jonufele]

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[elixiadragmire]

I'm more curious why this isn't more of a thing and why people don't want to cross promote more often with each other.

the thing is I do this and see this done .... everywhere. People will seek to find others who like the same things they do, so if they like something they tend to share it. Mechanically harvesting that thou comes off as false and sterile and people dont like being sold to, so they avoid such attempts. Its common human behaviour

[PotooGryphon]

Yes, exactly. I see this everywhere too.

@stevemyers773, I think your approach is just off, and I think everyone else is basically saying that too. It's more important to join a community and build friendships rather than try to ask as many of them as possible to help promote. It'll happen naturally once friendships are made and you enjoy each others series.

"Scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" is awkward to ask of a practical stranger. Think about approach a random people on the street and asking, "Scratch my back, I'll scratch yours". You'll probably get the same odds that you mentioned in your original post.

In fact, you could start right now, by introducing yourself to this community and participating in some thread topics, maybe try a couple of the art event threads. Just have fun and meet people.

[starlightcityentert]

I love so many comics on here and have talked to so many cool and kind creators on here that I try to retweet or promote anyone that I can on twitter when the chance comes up. Tapastic is a great community, hands down.

[stevemyers773]

My approach has actually been to do every avenue I can...I promote on my own, I promote others I like and if someone wants to cross promote, I do that as well. I guess I never thought of it as that odd...unless someone is doing offensive material I don't agree with, I'll always at least hear them out on the idea (shit, I've love a back rub hahah) so it's not to say everyone here I think is wrong or anything like that at all...I guess I just don't 'get it'? Like other than spamming my account with shoutouts, which is a different thing....what does it do but help you and another artist? So I guess I just see things differently and waste no time in doing this, like i said, as long as it's not offensive or hateful material...I'm totally down. Then again, maybe I just want to take more of these chances, maybe I'm at the breaking point of not having luck even though I've used these forums everytime I post, used DeviantArt, facebook, IG, on and on and just want to get my stuff out there badly enough I'm more than willing to simply shake hands and plug another artist if they help me.....ON TOP... of all the normal routes of self promotion/promoting other people just to do so. (which i think is important to clarify that this is extra promotion and not the sole source.)

Anyways, it's been a good discussion and insight...one maybe I still don't understand all the hesitation and I guess negativity towards the idea, but I dont want that to seem like I think youre all wrong or anything like that, it's just a difference of opinions on the matter. You're all amazing creators in an amazingly creative space and I value everyone's opinion whose contribute. bow so thanks for all of that.

BUT if anyone does like the idea of cross promotion/shoutouts.... hit me up:
Skooba's Sketchbook and message me here and we can work some stuff out.

Peace, love you all for contributing!

[keii4ii]

what does it do but help you and another artist?

To me, it boils down to this:

"Am I nothing more to you than an opportunity to advertise your comic for free? Is that the only reason you're talking to me?"

This is a cultural difference. In some countries, eye contact is perceived as an aggressive gesture. That doesn't mean eye contact is bad. But pretty much everyone can agree that unprovoked aggression is bad. Out of that agreement, one can try not to make uninvited eye contact when interacting with people from that culture.

Similarly, cross promotion proposals are not inherently bad. But you can agree that dehumanizing a fellow creator and reducing them down to a free advertising opportunity is bad, can't you? That's exactly how many of us perceive cross promo proposals, unless it's from someone you're already close friends with.

[stevemyers773]

i think you make a good point on it just being how different we perceive an action and our cultures/life experiences. Since I don't perceive it that way, it's never bothered me. I never see it as getting 'used' since it's a mutual exchange...I share yours, you share mine, we both get what we want... I also think some people see it as a pride issue maybe...like 'I don't want help, I need to do this on my own.' Or even maybe viewed as 'paying for likes'....

I guess I see it as a platform, an equal exchange between two people trying to get their stuff out there and using each other in a beneficial relationship, just for a chance to be seen. And if it's pride that's an issue, I think, your work still has to catch people. Like we post on a forum here with people, so that's using something with an audience already established....BUT...your work still has to be good enough to draw people in. I feel like I've encountered that feeling elsewhere with some artists.

But that perspective is great that you bring up Keii4ii, because it maybe just shows how differently something like this is viewed and what life factors we've all been through that may have come into play on what we think is happening in a situation.

[Kayke]

For me it's not a pride thing or feeling like I'm being used. It just feels insincere?

I want people to share my comic because they want to, not because we have an agreement. Something about that feels wrong to me. It's like the difference between having a friend buy you a drink and ASKing a friend to buy you a drink.

[colinwmd]

I feel the same way about the insincerity thing. I wouldn't want to feel obliged to shout out something I'm not necessarily that excited about.

Also, I think if you do too many shout outs they lose their value anyway. There are some creators on twitter whose retweets I'm less likely to click on simply because they do so many of them. Maybe they are genuinely excited about them all but when they arrive in my twitter feed in batches it feels very much like part of some agreement and so there's not much reason that I should be especially excited about them. Whereas when people only do it about the stuff they're genuinely excited about, it's more apparent because it's less frequent and it's usually more than just a retweet.

Not that there's any "right" or "wrong" way to do it, but as a follower I'm more likely to be interested in the latter examples. And my shout outs tend to be new stories I've recently got into, or specific updates I enjoyed from gag comics.