Am I bad if im an Athiest

[MoThErNaTure]

I ask people on here because they've never met me. Meaning they can't judge me by how I act or look. I feel safer asking on here.

[baasinsimple]

Where are you from if you don't mind me asking? I mean if your just talking to people through a screen your going to encounter mostly Americans, even debate wise, seeing as most homes have internet and other areas with a lot of internet and are more secular have a lower population, and Americans, for the most part, have a debating culture that's extremely abrasive. The people you encounter through the screen are a small yet sizable and very vocal minority in the states. Most Christians in the west don't really care what you are unless their from a community or your from the smaller religious communities. The average American doesn't really give a damn what religion you are or aren't. Most of my friends are Christians and they don't give a single shit that I'm Agnostic. It's like that everywhere here. If you're from a rural area and you've grown up on a sense of values then of course your going to confront alot of people who have different values. I mean, the U.S of A has a population 330,000,000 a small minority for us is like 2,000,000. Other places like the middle east that have a more... let's say different culture that is even less... welcoming to people of different religions have a very localized variation of social media, so of course you see less of them and there is less religious debate because it's very homogenized over there.

[MoThErNaTure]

I'm from south eastern america. I live in a extreme christian community. Also I get it. It can be abrasive. Now that I think about it, it was wrong of me to say most. I tend to not realize until corrected. I'm sorry if I confused you by any means.

[baasinsimple]

No problem, I happen to live in the same part as you, crazy what a simple change in community can change a person's experience.

[MoThErNaTure]

I know. It's nice to I guess get a whiff of the same fresh air. I come to the internet because I know i'll find more people with my problems.

[MoThErNaTure]

I actually used to be a christian. Then I found out a few things about myself. I didn't want to feel like I was a demon here to ruin god's land. I became mentally abused and mentally abusive to myself. So I guess it all depends on where you are, and who you are.

[Tobirone]

Thanks for calling me chill. I try! I didn't get my science degree only so I could deny everything else ****smiley****. Who knows who is right in the end. Or if everyone is wrong. Would be funny if that would be the case, huh? Or maybe everyone is right just by a percentage of degree.
All I can tell you by the information you gave us through this threat is:
If your community is that toxic to you, try to look for a new sanctuary which isn't causing you those problems. I know that that isn't always possible socially, financially or for various other reasons. But your psychological health is always as important as your physical health.
Christ isn't the problem. People who try to oppress others are. Doesn't matter if they act by "good will" if the result is destructive.

[nickysoh]

Saw this post late. Glad so many people chime in and you probably feel better now right?

but quite honestly, you shouldn't have felt bad in the first place because if you say you're an atheist, you don't believe in religion right? Then why should you fear or worry about people saying you're going to hell? It shouldn't exist lol.

It's like when I'm young my aunt always say if I don't sleep early the monsters will come in and take me away. I just laugh at her. I could have been angry right since she says monsters are coming to take me then... I assume eat me aLive or punish me? Why else would a monster come? But it sounds silly. It's the same thing so what's there to be angry about? Unless you really believe hell exist.

You can't control others from saying what they say but you can control how you feel.

[Tobirone]

I don't think that the worry is that something bad would happen if Lilly (I call you Lilly now, @LilArtistInTheMaking deal with it for the moment. ) were to die (later on! We all want you to be around as long as possible!).
Yes I think telling children that that they will be eaten by monsters If they would not go to bed is a bit harsh but, eh ... well who as a child didn't want to stay up late? I wouldn't do that but I also think that both situations cannot be compared that easily.
The problem here is more likely the social pressure Lilly's community is forcing on her (I am right with "she", right? If not: Sorry!). Of course you cannot control other peoples words. But sometimes people need to figure out their reality. Who is the anomaly? Who is the normal? Or even: What is the normal? Lilly needed reassurement and I think she luckily got plenty. At the same time people telling her, she'd go to hell also is the attempt of reassurement: It is to reassure the reality of this so called "believer" in a destructive way. Even if this believer means well by using those words (and going hell / hel / Thanatos etc. is one of the traditionally harshest things one could say) the clash is unevitable: Two different believe systems crash, which means there WILL be harm done. And if not one but more poeple tell her that she is wrong over a longer period of time, what would make that with her? Mental abuse is not what happens a fiew ours and then it's gone. It's something done over a long time distance.

Especially if one is younger finding out where you are, where you stand and what you stand for is very important. It is what makes you into an individual. If you're in a community (or group) where a norm has been archieved, being the person who falls out of that norm can be hard. How long did it take for gay people to archieve a "somewhat" norm to themselves, since heterosexuality in our western society is seen as the norm. And though the view has shifted a bit in the last three decades, we still have a long way to go in our western society.
Being in different in religious belief (and yes, I see atheism as a form of belief or rather non-belief) can be comparable. If you're in a community in which it is the norm to be protestant for example. Freedom of belief is what everyone should be allowed to have. Unfortunatelly in many countries - if not possibly most? - people are not allowed such freedom. Either by law of state (worst case) or due to social oppression (not the worst, but still bad). It is bullying on a religious level.

[eochoa92]

Christopher Hitchens would often say in his debate that he had a challenge that he never found anyone to beat.
It was simple. He said to think of anything wicked that someone or a group have done in the name of religion. Chances are your mind has thought of more than one. Then, he would say to think of how many bad things in the world have been done in the name of atheism?

[Mari]

Nope. Anyone who tries to push their agenda on you is the bad person.

[DiegoPalacios]

while i agree that terrible actions have been done in the name of religion, there have been horrible things done by people who are fighting against religion itself.

Selfish people will use anything as an excuse to hurt others. Getting rid of an excuse will only lead to them to look for another one.

[Mari]

As a side not it's always very weird reading these threads because being from northern europe AND part of the liberal section of my country I pretty much never run into people who aren't agnostic or atheist. On the internet it's always a reminder like "Oh right, that ain't the norm"

Also telling children they'll go to hell isn't really that big of a deal, I mean, again northern european, so whenever me or my brothers would act up my very atheist parents would say we were troll changelings and they would abandon us to the forest to get their real babies back xD. Actually my whole family was very big on finnish folklore based threats

[racarter]

Coming from me? As a Christian? A Southern Baptist Christian living in the Bible Belt?

No. You’re not bad for being an Atheist. Only God can judge you anyway. I don’t know any Christians who would condemn you for being an Atheist. Of course those types exist and clearly they don’t understand or were never taught about being compassionate, understanding, or patient.

You can’t force or berate anyone into converting. Oh you can try but you’ll just push them away further. You can’t make someone believe, it has to be their choice.

I’ve always held the belief of preaching without pushing, say your peace and let others make their own choices. Don’t try and scare them, or act like your superior to them. That’s just no good, it’s the antithesis of what being a good Christian is about. Unfortunately a lot of people don’t understand this. Most importantly, you just need to be there for others. Like don’t help others and expect them to convert in exchange, help them out of kindness. Help them because they are your fellow man.

What people privately think and believe is one thing, but saying “you’re going to hell” is just a horrible thing to say to someone. I mean what’s the objective in saying that? Are you trying to convert them? Scare them? Or are you just touting your sense of superiority over someone who believes something different than what you believe?

I see similar behavior in militant Atheists or any such group of people who are militant, radical, or extremist in their beliefs. I’ve been called a “superstitious retard” for being a Christian, been threatened, had to stop someone from setting other Christians on fire just for praying (said person I stopped was also a “friend” who threatened to set me on fire too - and she had a lighter in hand, lit, ready to use it). I’ve been harassed and berated by Atheists, Muslims, Wiccans, and one time a Gnostic. Half the time it was because I asked a question. The rest was because they just didn’t like me and thought my religion made me inferior to them.

This sorta dumb crap occurs in every group of people in all walks of life. It’s not okay for anyone to do.

Ugh, I could rant all day about it but to sum it up: No, you’re not bad for being an Atheist. Good or bad is all in how you treat others. You’re not bad for being an Atheist but you would be bad for being a militant Atheist since the are inherently arrogant assholes who get their kicks insulting others and thinking they’re superior (same for militant Christians and etc).

People are gonna have their opinions but that doesn’t excuse being a jerk to someone. Even if you believed an Atheist was gonna go to hell, that doesn’t mean you go and say it to them. That’s just rude and mean.

[Mari]

I disagree with you because you cannot preach without pushing. If you are going out of your way to try to argue your belief on someone, that is pushing.

[racarter]

Who said anything about arguing? There’s preaching in the sense that you’re just talking and then there’s being preachy, which is what’s annoying.

When I say “preaching” I don’t mean attempting to argue or be adamant about persuading others. I mean stating your peace. And people can eaither take it or leave it. Stating what you think and believe, presenting an option or opinion, that isn’t pushing. Pushing is trying to make others see things your way forcibly rather than letting them choose to see things your way.

So yes you can preach without being pushy. It’s presenting a path, not forcing you (or trying to force you) to take said path. Make sense? It’s presenting a message, not barking out orders. You can certain be pushy while preaching, but that isn’t exactly unique to religion - I’ve met plenty of Atheists who attempted to convert me and proceeded to insult and berate me when I didn’t. I’ve also met Atheists with whom I’ve had civil discussions with, we both did our respective preaching, but neither of us presented ourselves as superior to the other. We frequently ended on “agree to disagree” and we never insulted or belittled each other. I had said what I needed to say so that was the end of it, if they one day asked to come to church or something or started believing - cool. If not? Okay.

I’ve seen pushy preaching and non-pushy preaching. But what I was speaking of had nothing whatsoever to do with arguing. Personally I never bother to argue because most people who want an argument just want to egg me on. On occasion I am willing to discuss and present my viewpoint. What people do with it is up to them, I can’t make them listen. That’s why I don’t argue about it.

Nevertheless people do often equate stating an opinion, option, or having a discussion to be in and of itself “arguing” or attempting to push an opinion onto others. Even tho it’s not. It’s like thinking I’m saying “blue is a shit color and anyone who prefers it to red is an idiot” cuz I say “I like red, reds a good color”. But I didn’t even say anything about blue, so you’re just projecting your shit into what I say. For example.

People are just... touchy. Touchy people take everything personally and act like a different opinion is like you slapping them in the face. Not much you can do when it comes to dealing with those types so I’m just all “whatever, you do you” and hilariously enough it’s like they get more offended when I say that... but hey that’s because I’m not the one changing my opinion. To those sorts a different opinion is being pushy. I grew up with tons of people like that. It was really annoying.

[Mari]

If you are saying your piece when people do not want it, that is pushing. No matter how you phrase it.

[racarter]

You’re assuming people don’t want to hear it ever. It’s not pushing to state an opinion. Was that not clear in what I previously wrote? If people say they don’t want to hear it, fine. It’s best not to continue with them then. However people have the right to say what they want, they just don’t have the right or ability to force you to listen. Forcing would be pushing. Speaking is not pushing.

I think you might very well be one of those types I was just talking about since you seem to be deliberately misinterpretating what I say. Therefore it’s pointless to continue this. In the end it’s a matter of perspective, as I stated earlier some people are touchy. But hey man, not everyone is you and not everyone is me. That’s the ultimate point I was making.

You can disagree all you want, but that doesn’t make it true. It’s just true for you. Anyway, peace out. ️

[Mari]

If I said I was vegan and you talked at length about being a carnivore, that's pushing, and vice versa. If someone says they are an atheist and you insist on sharing your views on why they should not be, that is pushing. It's all I'm saying. If a person has landed on that they are an atheist, they have their reasons and there is really no reason to poke that further.

I am not, reasons why I can't stand Ricky Gervais is because he is so pushy with his atheism. I just also don't think people should pester someone who has made their stance clear.

[ratique]

Aaaand one last reminder to stick with the original topic.