Do you wish Tapastic had different sections for lesser comics?

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 08:02:34 UTC #1

Tapastic is a nice place but I've often found that Tapastic has a huge focus on the popular comics but never seems to give a chance to what I guess you should say are the underdogs of the story? Do you ever think Tapastic should have sections that help less popular comics get a bit more attention?

Right now we have 4 sections. Popular, Trending, Staff Picks and Fresh. Out of all of them, any popular comic with a lot of subs will ultimately appear in one of those four if not multiple. But a comic that is struggling for lack of better word will only appear in "Fresh."

Does one ever think some sections added to help would be beneficial? There could be a "New" section where legitimately new comics that have just been posted are shown. People can head here to see what are the brand new, completely "fresh" comics and not just ones that are being updated.

Perhaps there could be a "20 Sub Section" as an example. Here whenever a comic is posted, if it has less than 20 subs it might appear in this section. Regardless of what is done, I do think Tapastic has a strong inclination to only support the most popular work while showing very little if any support for the lesser comics.

I think something like Smackjeeves is a very flawed hosting site which beyond a few select points, doesn't hold a candle to Tapastic both in terms of design and support. But just having a "New" section to me is a nice thing to have and I do wish Tapastic could implement such a thing.

Aspie_Gamer 2016-09-10 08:22:14 UTC #2

Mmm...I think a 1,000 subs or less section would be perfect for newcomers and people like me who've been here awhile, but are still grinding day in and day out for a chance to help get into the big leagues.

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 08:33:37 UTC #3

I don't know about a 1,000 subs though. At best maybe 100 or less. To me, once you reach the 100 mark, heck in some cases once you reach the 50 mark, you have hit a point I think where your comic has become popular enough to get attention. It may not be the most popular, but it's definitely hit a mark.

If we had a 1,000 or less Sub Section, I think it would lead to the same problem now. All the incredibly popular comics would go there and any comic struggling or just starting would be stuck fighting agianst the popular comics.

LoboSong_Hitaka5Ever 2016-09-10 09:11:21 UTC #4

I definitely support this idea at 50 or 100 or less. Talented people deserve to be noticed and I think this idea would help with that

eleoza 2016-09-10 09:45:02 UTC #5

I 100% agree with the 'new comics' section!
'Underdog' comics need to be noticed too.
Having a comic that often appears on the populair front page I sometimes worry if it annoys people because it's always the same comics up front while there are so many comics out there that are so good and go unnoticed.
I think new sections would really help those comics, heck even a random section that randomly selects comics below 500 subs would be cool I think.

Kura 2016-09-10 10:15:41 UTC #6

I wouldn't call a comic with say 250, or even 500 subscribers 'incredibly popular' and if the number was capped at 1000 subs eventually the 'incredibly popular' comics would be thinned out as they reached that number. So you wouldn't be FIGHTING them, you would essentially be 'climbing the ladder WITH them' until your numbers got high enough to no longer need the service and you were removed from that 1000 sub and under section.

And this has been stressed in... many... many threads where this similar concern has come up, it's nice, and would be cool if they would, but they don't have to, are not obligated, and frankly, from their standpoint, and I usually don't jump to take their side. But, it's uhh... not their job to hold the hand of struggling artists. Heck even the 'incredibly popular' artists for the most part, usually got that way without tapastic support, tapastic support ONLY showing up after then had proven they could do well / grow fast / had potential to bring in traffic to the site with one of their series. Even more so than that, right now tapastic staff is currently very very focused on both working on and advertising other areas of their site/content at the moment. With all the gripes I have with tapastic 'they're not advertising for me or supporting my work enough' is generally not one of them.... because it's not their job. It's mine. Their job is to advertise the site as a whole, even the artists featured are being so in the attempt to attract users to the site. The featured/picked/advertised comics are used to make the site grow. Not that specific comic grow. (very sorry if that comes off as harsh)

That said, a NEW section would be nice but I can honestly make a list of things I would rather see on the site first (which also fall under the 'it is not their priority so they are not/maybe never going to work on it), there is already a way to organize series by subs/likes/views/comment/recently updated and name. So finding 'lesser known comics' is simply a mater of organizing it in whatever one you feel like, going to the last page and working your way up the list. If that is what you want to do.

And 'underdogs' section, as nice as it sounds, would imply that it would be hand picked stuff from staff... which... would result in staff having to decide if this low sub comic really 'needed' to be there, resulting in the same types of threads the 'staff picks' gets with the 'how do they pick the content for this?' 'there should be more restrictions/critera to meet' 'are series picked if they are too old, so they have to be new?' 'why is my series not picked' Which of course, does not make these threads invalided... just... from the website's standpoint, why would you add another version of something people are already complaining a lot about?

scythe 2016-09-10 12:24:00 UTC #7

I just wish you could search for comics by tags or keywords.

punkarsenic 2016-09-10 12:41:53 UTC #8

this is a real problem, and I imagine a solution would be a section similar to staff picks, but only of less popular comics. 'rough diamonds' or something. obviously, staff picks is filled with very pretty comics, regardless of story or amount posted, to create a good image to new visitors to the site, but the 'rough diamonds' section could probably relax on that.

idk abt a 'new' section - lots of comics take a little while to take off, so brand new comics might not be too alluring. Maybe if 'new' meant 'less than a month old'

genjiOtori 2016-09-10 13:16:32 UTC #9

I'm not really a big fan of putting another section on the page. It's already overwhelming enough if you visit tapastic for the first time. What I really love to see is fresh section to be more present on the front page (like this thread already proposed: http://forums.tapastic.com/t/the-main-page-is-meh-plz-be-patient-and-read-it-all/) and a better search function with e.g. tags.

In the end it's your responsibility to get more readers. Before tapastic (or other platforms) creators had their own webpage where they hosted their comics... there was no staff pick, no spotlight. You had to do your promotion on your own. With a platform like tapas it's easier because a lot of people come here like in a comic book store. You can't expect readers to magically read your comic: you need consistency, endurance and good skills. Like this thread already showed ( http://forums.tapastic.com/t/the-truth-about-an-audience/ ):you have to earn your audience.

Well of course it's a hard and long way and it's frustrating seeing all those amazing people on the front page. But that's just the tip of the iceberg named fame. You don't really see what's underneath the surface.

shazzbaa 2016-09-10 13:21:28 UTC #10

Like, do what @kurapikasuki suggested -- browse all comics, arrange by "subscribers," and then go to the last page and start browsing backwards.
Is that a section you'd spend a lot of time in, as a reader? Is that a section most readers would want to look through?

Setting aside the fact that there's really no benefit to Tapastic in advertising those comics prominently -- everything they showcase is meant to make the site look appealing -- I don't think a section like that would get you very much exposure! There aren't a whole lot of people browsing Fresh as it is, and "Like Fresh But Only For Comics That People Haven't Shown Interest In" doesn't strike me as a really popular reader destination.

It sounds like a thing that would help out comics under X number of subs, but I think that actually, saying "here are all the comics under 20 subs" just puts a big red flag over that section that "this is gonna be full of a lot of low-quality stuff." Sure, there will be good comics in there, but there will also be all the rushed, sloppy, poorly-done, inconsistent, or rarely-updating comics that can't break 20 subs for a reason. I don't know that that's a section many readers would be interested in searching through.

zetina 2016-09-10 13:25:48 UTC #11

you can! the episode tags don't work but in the main settings of your series, you can add tags for the whole series. i tested it out and it works

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 13:28:31 UTC #12

I'd call it pretty popular. 250 to 500 is a pretty big number in terms of popularity.

Whose holding whose hand? Tapastic literally has 3 sections designed to support popular comics. A section merely inscribed for new comics or a section inscribed for lower sub comics isn't going to hurt Tapastic at all. if anything it would help it because it gives readers not only a look at the popular and trending comics but the lesser ones that some might find potential in.

This isn't about advertisement, this is about opening up and allowing more potential to show through. Potential that could easily have been put in a little new section without any hindrance to the more popular comics being promoted on things like Popular, Trending or Staff Picks. You're making it sound like Tapastic needs to make time to make time to advertise lower sub comics when in reality the only thing Tapastic needs to do is just create a little section and then keep their focus on the popular comics.

Sites like Smackjeeves still has a "popular section" along with "comic spotlight" and "New and Hot" which is essentially the Staff Pick and Trending here are still there. If someone wants to see what's popular, they can go and see them.

Yeah I've seen their organization, it's kind of weak. I basically have to scroll through pages upon pages in the hopes of finding something. Which again only makes it more difficult. Let's say I want to look for a newer comic or one with low subs. I have to go all the way to browse all, pick the sort I want. Then I have to painstakingly scroll my way to whatever page I need. Most sites, comic hosting or not would have at least had the decency to allow you to type in the page you want and go their immediately. It's a huge pain in the butt and why do that when you can just have...

Popular/Trending/Staff Pick/ 50 or Less Subs/New

Want to see what some of the newest comics just being posted are? Click "New" and get yourself those 5 or so pages of brand new comics just now released. Want to see any comics that have 50 subs or less? Click the link and get yourself those 5 or so pages of recently updated comics that fill this requirement.

No it wouldn't. You make it sound like Tapastic's staff has to get down and dirty and start directly supporting lesser comics. The problem people have with "Staff Picks" is that you have comics earning great popularity with little work done in terms of episodes. People believe that simply more work needs to be put into the comic before it should be treated so well by Staff.

This is really a case of web design. Any good web designer could go to Tapastic and design the site so you have a "New" or "Certain Sub Section" and comics that fit those criteria would appear there without any hindrance whatsoever in regards to the actual popular comics.

You could even have a "Random" section if so be it and you'd have the same thing. It would just be a new section, that randomly picks out any comic. I don't need a "Random" section but it just goes to show how easy it an be done and how it can help expand the site and comics.

What happens when you get on Tapastic? The very front page is a spotlight of a comic, in a nice big banner. Below that are "Popular", "Trending" and "Staff Picks" with "Discover More" at the very bottom. Literally the moment you enter into Tapastic, you are bombarded by the most popular comics there, the best of the best sometimes.

So let's click on the "Comic" section. What is the very first thing it automatically focuses on? That's right the "Popular" section. It immediately goes to what Tapastic feels are some of the best comics ever. If I click on "Creators" the very first thing it does is bring me to the most popular users first.

Of course any good comic hosting site would allow me to arrange episodes around but I still haven't gotten that either.

I don't think it would really be a problem. I mean the idea of a "New" section is to show the literally newly hosted comics that have just come into play. These comics might be a single page or they might be a good long chapter with 20 pages. In the end it's really just an intention of bringing up comics that have just started.

"New" section isn't meant to be long lasting for comics. It's meant to just be a little push, a little way to get reader's attention and then after that it's up to the artist to keep pushing that comic's attention in the "Fresh" section. It would merely be a section where someone looking for the newest of comics to take a gander at.

You are making what I feel is the same mistake that Kura is making. You're making it seem like Tapastic needs to show a huge focus on new or lesser comics and this is suddenly going to hurt the site. Let me ask, if a new user gets on Tapastic and we have such new sections made. Do yo uthink they'll come in, see a "20 Sub comics or something" and say...

"These are horrible, I'm never going back to Tapastic again."

Of course not! Because they're already being bombarded by all the great things Tapastic has to offer. Here, this would be nothing more than a little side section under the reader's own choice to check out or not. A lot people actually like having a "New" section itself because they want to see what some of the newest hosted comics are.

And a "New" section is a lot simpler to have and work with than trying to use Tapastic's crazy excuse of a "Browse" section.

Man...Got a lot posted there.

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 13:48:37 UTC #13

Double post but I really don't want to add more to my massiveness above.

Let me ask a question. If we implemented let's say a "New" section what are the drawbacks? What would make it so flawed that it would be best not to have it? Because for me, when I see a "New Section" that's exciting because to me, it's a place where I get to meet potential new comics, potential new artists and a way of greatly expanding my reading sources.

I would come into Tapastic and probably the first thing I'd do is go to this "New" section just to see what's being offered. When I was on Smackjeeves I did the same thing. Mainly because the "Popular" sections were all the same thing.

So again I must ask, where does this hurt Tapastic? Because all I see personally is benefit and Tapastic can expand itself greatly. You have the focus on the popular comics, you have the focus on the new and lesser comics. You still have your spotlight, trending, staff picks. You still have your Fresh.

All I'm seeing is a wide open world.

And I do feel the need to say this. Some of you make it sound like Tapastic is a bookstore. If this were true, yes it would make sense to show as much greatness as you can and keep back as little of the lesser comics that are around. Because you want to entice buyers to purchase your product and you can't do that if you have scribbles on the front page.

But Tapastic isn't a bookstore, it is a comic hosting site, a free one where users of all sorts and ages can post their work. I don't think there is any need to have this kind of "work hard or die" mentality where the strong get support and the weak get weeded out and never see the light of day.

nessiefynn 2016-09-10 14:04:46 UTC #14

I can get behind a more prominent fresh section, but I don't see how an under 20/100/whatever subs section would really be that useful. Why would readers want to specifically seek out comics with few subscribers? While fewer subscriber doesn't necessarily translate to lower quality, that's what a lot of people would assume, and so many people would ignore a low-sub section entirely.

genjiOtori 2016-09-10 14:08:14 UTC #15

Well it's more like a bookstore than you think. But instead of purchasing money you purchase attention - attention used for ad that can be exchanged by money. And Tapastic is a business. The front page should showcase what it stands for, what audience it wants to reach. And if they put some newly created comics on the frontpage they kinda loose that kind of sparkle (and also they loose a bit of control what is on the front page, more than with trendy and popular)

Also I don't really understand why you want a NEW section. We have fresh where everyone who updates a new episode is shown. If you click on "comics" at the top or the goat way down the front page you'll get there. You even can filter by genre to get comics more to your liking. And if your art and story is captivation you won't stay under 20 subs very long.

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 14:15:18 UTC #16

20 under may be too little, but I wanted to get a number that at least seemed feasible for starters. And also the possibility of having a limit might help. Plus I honestly wanted to get a number that was less than my own subs so I didn't sound desperate.

Perhaps one should take out the "Less than" part and just have a "20-50 sub" section. That number might need to be dwindled to 30 or 40 at tops to be fair. So here it's like, you still need to work hard to get the subs you need but if you manage to keep up the good work and get to that number.

And while I wouldn't want too many sections just to build off on that you might have "50-100 sub section" and then "100-500 sub section" and then 500-1,000+ subsection" and so on. Essentially each time you manage to hit a certain mark, you are rewarded for your efforts.

But once you do, here's a little reward for working so hard and and it's up to you to keep working hard and keep building those subs up. Either way you're going to have to keep updating and keep on moving if you want people to check out your comic.

shazzbaa 2016-09-10 14:25:09 UTC #17

Nah, I don't think it would be like that. But these are my two main thoughts:

It doesn't benefit Tapastic to make a section for those comics. They can have that section, but why? When they have a section dedicated to popular and trending comics, it's not to promote those comics -- it's so that people who come to Tapastic see the best that Tapastic has to offer. I wouldn't say it's some big massive undertaking to add a sub-20 (or 20-50) section, just that there's no compelling reason to do so.
It likely won't benefit sub-20 (or 20-50, or sub-100) comics because most readers won't look at that section. I'm not saying a sub-20/20-50 section will drive readers away, just that it will be ignored. So basically, the one reason for creating that underdog section -- helping underdog comics get exposure -- probably wouldn't help much in practice, meaning there's even less of a reason for Tapastic to implement it.

I don't think there are drawbacks, per se, just that it's a bit redundant with "Fresh," so there's not really a big reason to implement it. I can understand preferring it, and sure, it wouldn't hurt anything, but I don't think it would add a lot to the site to have a distinct section from Fresh that's just brand new comics.
(tho I guess it could maybe take away attention from Fresh -- most people probably aren't gonna check BOTH new AND fresh, since they're a little redundant -- and that would mean even fewer eyes on comics that are low in subs but not brand new)

sarrowsmith10 2016-09-10 14:30:37 UTC #18

I'm pretty sure this is the problem that any art hosting site has. Deviant art, smackjeeves, ect. I don't think there is a solution that will make everyone happy. Tapastic.com has a balance to make: generate revenue and honor the community of creators that supports them.

One thing that I think a few people have touched on that is an ongoing problem is the lack of a comprehensive search feature. Perhaps improving search functions to include limits on subs or newness or tags or a number of things perhaps would be a good compromise?

ReroOnyx 2016-09-10 14:37:26 UTC #19

Fresh for me is the equivalent of "Just Updated" something that appears in a lot of comic hosting site. The difference between it and "New" is that "New" basically gives new comics a little bit of the spotlight. Here's a little attention for just starting out. But then like everyone else if you want to keep that attention you have to keep posting and get into that "Fresh" section.

Considering how quickly comics come in, it might even have to be designed differently. A "New" section might be 1 page, maybe 2 pages and every 2-3 days (if that long) it rotates the upcoming comics.

So as an example let's say I create a new comic. This comic would go to the "New" section as well as the "Fresh" section. For a day or so, that comic will always be on the "New" section. After a set time, a new rotation is given, my comic is taken off "New" and is replaced with the next batch. If I want to get more attention, I better work hard and get it on that Fresh.

Kayke 2016-09-10 14:50:57 UTC #20

I mean we have all of those "Under 100" "Under 50" "Under whatever" topics here on the forum and it doesn't seem like people check those other than to just promo their own comics. I don't know how many people who are solely readers on the main site would be interesting in sifting through such a list. I know when I'm in reader mode, I don't really look at the "Fresh" section to find new comics, I either check the top comics in the genre I feel like reading or I look through a friend's reading list to see if they're reading anything good that I haven't seen yet.