How can we(artists and writers) help each other to earn a living?

[JackOfArtAndProse]

For those among of us who feel cooperative and want to encourage each other to actually reach the next level in doing this stuff for a living, what can we do to bring out the best in each other, for the sake of commercial marketability? What practical steps could be taken, and are we ready to commit to those steps? This is a post for those of us who want to ponder and then take actionable steps towards that future.

I would suggest that we would focus on identifying problems and then suggesting practical solutions. Whether people here apply those solutions isn't up to us, although I hope to see progress in our art and writing careers.

I'll start by identifying two particular problems I've noticed among us: I've noticed that some of us(and sometimes myself, at least in the past) complain about not having a big enough readership while abhorring the idea of working on their craft to become BETTER at it. This is also a big reason for why many of us don't find collaborators despite desperately hoping to nail one.

Another problem I've noticed is that we(artists and writers) don't utilize social medias as well as we could. My suggestion to this would be more efficient collaborative planning and cross-promotion(all kinds of ideas would be much appreciated). We also lack knowledge about specific hashtags that people already utilize to point our followers to content that we appreciate and would like our followers to check out(#FF comes to mind). The problem here is that Twitter is actually shadowbanning people who retweet too much, so figuring out a way around this would be paramount for us. That is yet another problem we need to figure out how to solve.

So basically, helping young artists to become better at honing their craft(and encouraging them to spend time writing/drawing) is paramount. Also, we need to figure out ways to cross-promote(without being obnoxious about it) and to have each others' backs. That said, this attitude can also be abused by those with lower follower counts, so I think we should build these social media relations on genuine relationships.

This is I have for starters. Chime in with your solutions and problems, and let's figure this stuff out together.

[droidmonkey1]

Bouncing idea out of what you've wrote.
what if every creator here that use social media to promote them self will add an #tag that all agreed on, to their post about their creation like #(genre)(story/comic). by doing so creators tapas will find it maybe find a new creation they like and retweet it or recommend it, and add the hashtag. every creator followers will see it and then hope for a bigger exposure.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

Just asking for clarification: who is going to find those hashtags, and what will they do? I'm somewhat confused.

[Luminosophy]

A big one would be celebrating and supporting artists who do manage to find full time success with their work. You see it all the time, artists shooting down each other for daring to charge for their work, let alone be fortunate (and hard working enough) to make it their career. Granted, I feel like the majority population that do it are themselves young hobbyists with no concept of having bills to pay.

As far as cross-promotion goes it's unfortunately ineffective most of the time. Creators engaging in it need to have similar style/ genre for their audiences to be interested. Which means it needs to be done organically, which means it's a slow process lol. I think the things within our control are just cultivating the right attitudes towards ourselves and ensuring young artists develop healthy relationships with social media. Like trying your best to reach new eyes, but don't set impossible standards of metrics and burn out. Learning how to develop an unbiased eye so they can detect their own weaknesses but not become hyper critical of themselves. Making sure it's understood that it's a long process of learning and improvement rather than getting lucky overnight and "being discovered", whatever that might mean.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

I would add that what you said is especially important in the context of our Tapas community. If we can't be happy when one of "our own" succeeds, how could we be happy when a stranger makes it? And if we can't be happy when one of "our own" succeeds, we really have deep-rooted envy issues and need to deal with them.

So yeah, I do agree. But that also requires a deeper sense of community. Granted, I myself am back to these forums after being off for about a year or so, so me feeling out of it is normal. However, I deeply wonder if we could somehow infrastructure our progress and look after each other and encourage each other to defeat our weaknesses?

...I actually think that creating a Tapas Discord server for those who REALLY want to get better and to connect and to get ahead would be a great idea. I mean, it has been done before, but I think that creating a Discord server for the sole purpose of skill advancement and trying to reach the point where an individual writer/artist can do this stuff for a living would be HIGHLY useful. The server would require some mods and basic rules, and we'd need to weed out arrogant elements while allowing for constructive criticism. It's a tought balancing act.

...Hmm. Even if we create a Discord server(which I'm now considering), it wouldn't be a useful prospect unless enough people(both skilled and unskilled) become interested in the idea. Anyway, good thoughts all around!

[droidmonkey1]

You post on social media a post about your work on tapas or somebody else's work. you add the #.
people that follow you may click on the tag or people from tapas. they will see all other posts with the tag, and may like retweet or even subscribe to one of them. it's all a big question of if.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

Ah, I get it now. Thank you for explaining.

That tag idea might not be a bad one. Especially if we all make at least one post with the tag and our project, so that people can utilize it. That said, people outside Tapas forums would have no idea what those tags are about, unless they're clear enough.

...How about making tags like #Tapasfantasy or #Tapasdrama or #TapasBL. Once we come up with clear hashtags, people would have no problems trying to find out story content related to their own genre. The problem is that some people would spam the heck out of these hashtags, and nobody could find other people's story content.

...Bleh. This stuff requires some work.

[nixxusnibelheim]

I think one of the key and you mention it here is having a sense of community.
Our first intent is to reach higher high but realistically without people that's not possible. If we play all alone by ourselve on our little corner, we create a gap from opportunities.

Something that I learned and it was quite obvious when I heard it from community manager, successful entrepreneur etc, it's to be involved in the community, not only replying to people in your account but taking the step to talk to other artists, showing support, be welcome to organic collaboration etc. Basically what we are doing here by sharing our struggles as comic artists, giving feedbacks...

Of course people will say that they don't have time specially if they work full time and then have to work on their craft at night, the struggle is understandable but maybe if they feel like their reach have become stagnant, it's because they are lacking in communication whether it's to be active on their social media or just socially active in the community.

I'm down for a discord server but I've joined 2 from tapas and we don't talk at all. I feel like people are having a hard time to engage because at the end of the day, we're all strangers People don't necessarily want to say too much about themselve or be vulnerable.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

Mhm, and with Discord servers the crux of the idea is to get folks to interact. That requires some planning and action on the server creator's(and mods') part. I figure such a Discord server would work if we had a clear idea of what kind of help we can provide each other, and if we consistently keep providing that to each other.

A couple of things a Discord server could provide:
-General chat in which to get to know each other and our daily struggles
-Collaboration channel where we can ask folks for collaboration(this one would get flooded early on, but it'll even our as folks realize that both collaborators need a measure of skill or else nothing will take place
-Events and challenges for both writers and artist
-resources for mastering the craft for both writers and artists, as well as a tips+tricks section
etc.etc.

This is the basic framework I had in mind.

[nixxusnibelheim]

Honestly, I don't know if it's a failproof system but the only discord server I'm active in, is a server that feel like a chatroom first, I think that's the way to go if you want people to engage more.
We are small in it and don't promote the server at all, it's almost like a private server or a group convo' between friend.
There is no clear rule, in fact we mostly talk in one channel even when we share our work, links, tutorials etc so the conversation can flow naturally. We also allow controversial topics because we are human and adult, so we can "yell" at each other and still remains friends afterward but it's also because we want to grow and eventualy be educated in topics we are not familiar with.

The extra channels we created, were out of necessity like our project, drawing or gaming talk but it happened only because our conversation flooded too much the main channel, to the point where we felt like we only talk about one topic so the people who didn't relate couldn't feel "at home" anymore. (The server grew organically)

But even with the extra channel, we still allow ourselve to talk about our project, gaming etc in the main channel just for the sake of letting the conversation growing organically.

And fun fact, when I got in, I knew nobody, I barely knew the guy that invited me. But right from the start, the banter between them felt so casual, a place where people could be vulnerable that it made me feel comfortable to talk to them.
So naturally as the year went on, we started to support each other's works in social media. We elevate each other's work by providing interesting feedbacks/angles, I know the in-depth of their project and they know mine.

Of all the server I tried to be invested in, it's the only one where I'm active, I'm there everyday just for the chat to the point where it slowed down my productivity

So I'd say, if we create a discord server I think it should be the priority to make people feel like they can talk freely without the feeling that they will be "punished" for saying something or posting something they shouldn't etc.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

With the exception of NSFW content(those can have their own channels) and spamming memes, perhaps.

[droidmonkey1]

I thought something more like #comedycomic #comedynovel

[JackOfArtAndProse]

That might be too vague of a hashtag and might not incorporate Tapas folk well enough. Otherwise, I do agree that it's a good hashtag, but others might already be using it, so... Hmm...

[GesuGesu]

To actually help each other earn a living, artists need to start considering things from the consumer's perspective. We can't help each other if we only know what we want and not what the audience wants. This is not to discourage you from writing and drawing your little niche interests, but to help you understand that two mutually niche artists with low follower counts on both sides will not be able to do much to support each other financially. We may reblog, share, retweet, and crosspromo all we want, but if we don't understand consumerism, this is wasted energy. At most, we'll only be supporting each other emotionally, but not financially.

[JackOfArtAndProse]

That is a good point. So, I would argue that a good writer would create works that have wide appeal - not because they compromise on their vision, but because they create work that can appeal to multiple audiences. That's challenges, true - but a good writer/artist should be able to do that much, if they want to do this stuff for a living.

...That, or, as someone said, to become REALLY good at a VERY narrow niche that no one else shares with them.

[BobbyjoeX]

I don't think im ready for BL XD

[SuperRazz]

Yes!

And I don't think what you're saying necessarily translates to : "bl is popular therefore make bl".

Even niche interests can be made and marketed well when patterns in consumer behavior are considered. A comic has poor chance of gaining interest if it's too niche. But if it's too similar with every comic made in its genre, it will be difficult for it to stand out. The premise should have a balance of both uniqueness and familiarity.

And I do wish there are more discussions about consumerism without criticizing what's popular

[GesuGesu]

There was a good video I saw that somewhat covered this topic.

Basically, you can attract a wide audience with a conventional Title +concept, because people tend to go for what is familiar to them. But you can present them with something completely unexpected within the trick layer of the concept, which compels them to stay due to the twist. This is usually how a story might keep an audience.

People love niches too, but it takes clever marketing to get people to initially click on your stuff in the first place before giving them the goods.