I personally felt like sub4sub didn't really do anything for me but artificially raise my numbers.
Like I eventually ended up with like 32 subscribers and then I'd release a chapter that only has 4 views like a week after releasing it. I also ended up with comics I really didn't like in my notifications that I made myself read anyway because I'd subscribed.
But that's just me, what's your personal experience with sub4sub?
Mar '23
Mar '23
Your experience is exactly why sub for sub is pointless which is why I never engage it in 
. I do understand creators with low sub/view counts want an outlet to support themselves however it doesn't help. The best way to go about promotion is to engage in social media, interact the the forums and try to promote in multiple platform as much as possible and all these steps take a lot of time and consistency and not to mention a lot of work.
Whenever I see sub for sub post I can't help but chuckle because I know that 9 out of 10 the people who sub to you will not read your work and even if they do it will be at that point in time and as time passes, whenever they get a notification of your update, they will unfollow you since they never really cared for it in the first place.
It's all a game to some people. a tactic to grow subs without realizing how empty those following are.
I feel the same. I think it's better to have a lower sub count, but organic and genuine, rather than a lot but don't really care.
I don’t mind sub for sub because it might incentivize someone to check out my comic that might not normally bother. I’ve got some active readers from it. I also have some comics that I enjoy reading that I wouldn’t have normally given a chance. My biggest peeve with sub for sub is when someone subs to you and then drops you later after you’ve already subbed to them.
At the beginning I tried to join the sub4subs threads, but then I stopped when I noticed just a few of the people that subscribed actually read my comic. I don't want to ruin my engagement on the site anymore, I'm already facing views that don't bring ad revenue to my comic.
I try to read the ones I subscribed to, but they are really a lot and I end up following in an active way just few of them, while I try to continue the others when I have free time.
That’s the hardest part for me. I want to ACTUALLY read people’s comics that I sub for sub to, but it’s hard to keep up. I only post 1-2 times a week and some people are posting everyday, sometimes multiple times a day.
I like sub for sub threads and I sub for sub. It has led to me finding and enjoying people’s works that I might not otherwise have checked out and I know some people feel the same way about my novel. It’s kept me entertained as a reader and seeing different styles and genres and other variation in writing has helped me become a better writer as well.
I came here for wholesome BL comics and ended up finding a whole lot more as well as a place to post my own writing.
At some point it could become unsustainable but I haven’t reached that point yet.
I feel like a broken record, telling people over and over again why it's pointless... While clearly being here with over 2500 subs without having used it... but here we are again...
It's unsustainable growth. The forums only have so many members, so there's going to be an inevitable cap on how many subs you can get, but more than that, there's no way you can seriously read all those comics and novels you don't care about... and most of the other people who sub to you via sub-for-sub won't do the same for you.
It's no more effective to get eyes on your work than posting in literally any other thread. In fact, with how many people have muted the entire promotions category, it may actually be less effective for getting seen, especially getting seen by people who genuinely want to engage with and leave comments on other works than more general threads discussing stuff like story and art. Especially if you remember to put a link to your work in your forum bio so if you say anything interesting at any time it could result in a sub.
Subs don't really do much for your position in the rankings, and so will not improve your visibility. You need likes for that. A large number of likes in a short space of time (like 1-3 days), and that means for the best visibility, you need to keep gaining readers who actually like your story and leave likes. People who gave it a cursory look and clicked subscribe aren't particularly helpful.
"Oh yes they are, Darth! They allow me to unlock ad revenue!" ...Yeah, but... You need to accumulate $25 to withdraw it. If nobody's actually reading, your typical ad revenue might be $0.01 a month or less... meaning it'll take over 200 years for you to earn any money you can withdraw. Earning money isn't everything with a work, and it's fine not to care about the money, but don't use this excuse to try to justify sub-for-sub, it's a very silly excuse.
That said, I can totally sympathise if your goal is to get rid of that progress bar on your dashboard, because I'm not a fan of it either, and if I ran Tapas for a day, you know that'd be the first thing to go. 
Still... there are better ways to get subs. Slower, yes, but better, trust me.
It's ignoring the issues with your work that are stopping it from growing organically. If people aren't clicking on your stuff when they see it on Tapas, on the forums or on discord, without being "paid" to do it with a sub... you probably need to make changes to things like your cover, how you advertise or talk about your work, or the work itself.
If you want people to read your comic or novel, you have to make something that looks interesting or fun to read, and nicely presented. If no matter how much you post your link, it never seems to result in subscribers, there's a whole forum of people who could help you work out why and how to fix it.
There's no special number of subs you can get to by sub-for-subbing where people will suddenly start thinking your novel or comic must be good because it has a lot of readers and start choosing to read it. And the Staff won't suddenly pay more attention to your work because you managed to sub-for-sub your way up to 100 subs; they still judge based on whether they think it'll appeal to the broader Tapas audience and look appropriately well-presented and fitting for the platform.
Basically... think about your goal in the long term. Don't get distracted by the fleeting dopamine rush of seeing a number go up faster. You need to think in terms of how you're going to entertain readers, how you'e going to present your work to entice them in, and in a way that makes the staff feel like it's a good fit for the Tapas brand and worth promoting to readers.
There are people in this community who are really keen to help you achieve these goals. They'll give you honest advice, link you to tutorials and resources...You don't need to resort desperately to offering subs, because you're in a community where if you have the drive to improve and to build a following, you can get the guidance you need to do it. 
I agree with you on that. There’s a lot of comics and novels that I wouldn’t normally click on and ended up thoroughly enjoying. There’s not necessarily anything wrong with them, it’s just stuff that’s not my typical taste. Like I don’t usually read web novels. I think you and I did a sub for sub though and Elf Noir has been a treat to read as well as Clari’s “Airy Nothing”. I’m also enjoying Guro’s new vampire web novel. And as far as comics go, I don’t usually go for punchy funny one shots, but Box Bunny Comics has given me a lot of good laughs as well as some of the other ones I’ve read. I doubt I would’ve read any of those if I hadn’t done the sub for sub threads. I know a lot of the subs I get through those are basically pointless subs, but I’m not really doing it for the numbers. I’ve talked to enough people on Tapas to know that the ad incentives are next to nothing, so I don’t really sweat it too much if I don’t get anywhere with those new subs. It’s introduced me to a lot of fun and interesting reads and gotten me out of my box. Some of my most active and vocal subs I’ve gotten through the sub for sub and that’s been really cool. So while I don’t recommend as means to become successful, I don’t think it’s without merit, depending on what your goals are. I don’t really expect to be successful in the webcomic community since my comic doesn’t fit the format well, but I’m at least enjoying the ride and trying out new things.
This is how I feel, and why I think the sub for sub threads have been a net positive for me. It helps me connect with other writers and artists. It introduces me to some cool stuff I might not have found or checked out otherwise. And it has gotten me some active readers/likers/commenters who seem to genuinely enjoy my novel.
As for the marketing aspect, I think others have raised some good points, but I also think sub for sub can be a useful part of a more comprehensive marketing strategy to get readers and the important likes and comments for the visibility algorithm, which in turn helps you reach more people, particularly for new works by not already established writers. But while I've been here awhile as a reader, I am new here as a writer and I don't have all the answers or know how everything works.
I think people who haven't used it haven't heard enough from people who do what positives there are, and seem to assume it's a marketing/growth tool only, and that it's the only marketing/growth tool people who do it are using.
I'm not here to become famous or rich, and I know that my novel is pretty niche (novel on a comic site/popular novel category but not falling into the most popular subgenres and styles/dark, urban and gritty) but I have had a blast writing it and am thrilled to share it with some readers who have come to like it. Sub for sub has helped contribute to that.
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