And that's where my wording was rather terrible. The first statement and the second one don't go together very well.
But I do stand by it that there is value in the writings of the fool. It's important to try and understand the world from the point of view of someone who doesn't understand you. Because the more we understand how people consider reality, the better we can be at catching when people are wandering in the wrong direction and at helping them understand our own views.
Ah, that's a complicated issue.
As in the previous comment, I do think there's value in the writings of the fool, but when it comes to children, we do need extra caution.
I wouldn't throw Oodolf Hootler's book Moin Kompf on a fire for its historical/psychological value, but I wouldn't want the kids to be reading it, since it preaches all the wrong things. (and that's perhaps a rather extreme comparison again)
I don't think JK Rowling shouldn't be allowed to write or publish, or that people are wrong for continuing to read her work, but I do agree that we need to take care with these things since just letting people do whatever can get out of hand real fast.
Huurgh. I don't like not having a clear answer. Your earlier comment is pretty spot on, when you mentioned Orson Scott Card.
Sure, but I disagree with other parts of that statement too.
It's so disingenuous to preach tolerance while simultaneously being intolerant. It muddles the message, and brings into question who that person really thinks is worthy of tolerant behavior. I'm not going to listen to a bigot about tolerance, not especially if they put that message into their literature. Not because I can't separate the art from the artist, but because on top of being bigoted, I realize the person in question is willfully ignorant or a liar. And in this case, she's all three. Ah, allegedly. . .
They did answer your question, with a video. There is also google, if you're actually feeling particularly curious. Or, the radfem tweets from the source. Either way, there are resources.
At the end of the day, JK Rowling had to say nothing. She could have just sat back on her billion dollar wizard empire, she could have shut up forever, but she didn't. She actively chose her role as a vocal TERF, and I think we all need to remember that.
But there's the thing. If that person preaches tolerance, it must be because they believe that tolerance is good. If they are themselves intolerant, it must be because they don't understand they are being intolerant. There is value in trying to understand why they think the way they think.
You don't need to learn tolerance from her books. If anything, the value of reading it comes from trying to understand how or why she misses the mark.
People aren't bigots just because, and the most effective way to reduce bigotry is to try and understand the people we think are wrong, rather than brushing them off as not worth trying to comprehend. If we can't do that, then we have no hope of improving things or getting people to understand.
Of course, that doesn't mean you should read the books, just that it isn't inherently wrong to do so.
Just a quick interjection here: It's often a waste of time to truly try to convert the utterly bigoted to your side. While some will change their minds, it takes years and years of dedicated effort. Much likes cults, deradicalising someone from an extremely bigoted belief takes the person realising for themselves that the rabbit hole has taken them to a place they don't want to be. The issue that comes is that a lot of people in these rabbit holes believe that they are right and it's everyone else that is wrong. The way that bigoted groups work as well is to lovebomb people and then isolate them to keep them locked off from rational people who oppose the group.
So understanding how people fall into these holes is super interesting and helpful as a method of prevention and healing once they come out. But actually getting people out? That often takes a lot of work by a skilled therapist who specialises in deradicalisation work.
I think another thing to consider in these discussions is whether or not the original author is still alive and profiting off further support. For example, H.P. Lovecraft was a horrible racist (even considered racist during the racist early 20th century) but consuming his products now no longer profit him and potentially support a harmful ideology(to my knowledge, at least). However, if you found out that an author you like, who is still alive, used their profits to support a movement you are vehemently against, I'd say there's a lot more to consider in that case. I don't know if Rowling is actively funding anti-trans organizations or anything, but to some people their standards for offering their support are lower than simply funding harmful ideologies. Some people might get around this by only consuming their products through illegal means, thus not giving them financial benefit, but that's another conversation.
I'm not saying the above is necessarily my view, in fact, I'm still not fully clear on where I stand on this issue. I know if I found out a creator I've given money to was using their profits to fund, say, a white supremacist organization, I'd have no issues not consuming their product anymore. But what if there's no evidence they financially support these organizations? Or there's plausible deniability that they just say really off-color stuff every now and then but might not necessarily be a white supremacist? Or maybe we find out everyone is donating to these white supremacists and my money's going to them no matter what? Those are the types of scenarios where I might think "It's too much effort to try to be a good person, I'll just go back to blissful ignorance."
People are not perfect and we should still read Harry Potter despite what J.K. Rowling said. Yes, you can disagree with what she did, but there is no need to take your anger all the way out and start burning her magic books. What she did was a mistake, and she like everyone else is not free of sin. humans are like this sometimes. Humans are complex.
Every cent that goes to her potentially goes to more transphobic, harmful things getting pushed ahead by her influence and funds; her ""justifications""" for her beliefs already have been used by other people. There's no justification to buying the new game, most of all "we need to support the devs" (devs rarely get sales bonuses, they've already been paid), much less any new books/movies where she has full control - and old ones give her more influence and engagement. It's also directly giving eyes to the new book where it's ENTIRELY about transphobic beliefs, so hey how about just find a nice wizarding school book on Tapas and giving money to that author instead
I'd just like to point out, it was not a mistake. The first half dozen or so times, sure maybe you can believe it was a mistake. But a full essay? You don't write an essay and than a transphobic book by accident. Mistake is not the right word. Mistake implies she didn't mean it.
oops I fell on my keyboard and made several rants and essays for years about how trans women can take away women's rights. My bad, lol. Only human
Really it not on me or you to forgive her, @WhiskeyClone it on the people she insulted.
I can understand giving someone the benefit of the doubt, but Rowling is being bigoted and willfully ignorant. This isn't a mistake, its a pattern of behavior. Should people send her death threats or degrade the people who enjoy and purchase her work, no. But down playing what's she done said and how it affects others, is not helping the situation. Chalking up her behavior to a 'mistake' is pretty irresponsible.
I feel like you're talking about two different types of people. Let's face it: people throw around -phobes and -ists way WAY too easily. Many times, the person on the receiving end would never consider themselves to be whatever the label thrown at them is. IIRC, Rowling does not consider herself to be transphobic or a TERF so when she gets approached in that way, it really doesn't do much to help. Those types of people I do believe you can talk with and at least come to an understanding. If she says something factually wrong, the best thing you can do is use your voice and own platform to spread the correct information. But screaming out -phobe or -ist, people are just going to shut you out and ignore you (general "you" here, don't mean anyone specifically).
Then there are the people who are actually part of brainwashing groups who are really just looking for a place to belong or let out their rage at the world or whatever. Those people need help in a completely different way. No matter what you say to them, it doesn't matter. I watch a lot of flat Earth "debates" and I can tell you, a lot of them repeat the same things over and over. This is because flat Earth is basically like a cult and they spread around videos and have discords/FB groups where they repeat the same thing. No matter how much evidence is presented to them, they absolutely refuse to see it. Presenting arguments doesn't help and many of them need real, professional help and someone close to actually get them out of the group.
Onto the issue of the thread, I'll just say that I agree that cancel culture is complete BS. It doesn't do anything, it oftentimes backfires and it only riles up people and pisses them off and divides us more. If you don't like what someone has to say, use your own platform to say what you think is right. At the end of the day, we will never agree with each other. We will never completely understand each other. Oftentimes, the intentions of the person saying or doing the thing is misunderstood, especially on Twitter with its character limit really, really doesn't help.
The only time cancel culture works is when someone has gone out and committed an egregious crime. Like I think most people can agree that Shueisha continuing their contract with the Rurouni Kenshin author is wrong, though thankfully they did cancel their contract with the writer for Act-Age who had gone out and attacked two middle school girls.
Adding a JK Rowling's worth of legitimacy to the anti-trans people seems pretty egregious.
And the people protesting aren't really trying to change her mind or those if her followers. They're trying to warn everyone else and maybe send a message to the corporations. You don't want any part of this controversy.
It's here today and it'll be gone tomorrow, that's my honest opinion on it.
Like I think if you try to make change through shame it just never works. It just makes people more cemented in their ways.
And when it comes to people losing their minds on twitter about this...I think it's partly covid? Being quarantined forever? the worst year ever just happening outside our windows?
And...honestly the book funds thousands of artists and writers. She ain't even writing the series anymore. The only people you're banning is the artists trying to get a foothold in this industry. If you want to ban her works ban her new works she's making now not the old stuff.
And one last thing--as a millennial who is old enough to have been Harry's age when the 3rd book came out. We don't care. We've known about JK for a good long time and we were there for the series, not for JK Rowling. (I blocked her like 5 years ago, y'all are late!) The more she has added to the series the more the HP fandom was like "stawwwwp your work is so bad!" And the stuff that was made without her input so much was actually pretty good.
So I don't really see it as fully her creation anymore! In the same way I don't see other book inspired movies as owned by their respective writers. These things start as books by one author--and then after a while...it's just owned by everyone else. She'll slowly lose more and more control and then...Harry Potter will be free to do whatever it wants.
I've never read harry potter, so I have zero attachment to JK and her work (closest I've come to consuming harry potter at all is enjoying the theme park at universal and having watched one of the fantastic beasts movies) so as an outsider I'll say: I might've given her post-HP works a chance since she was such a massive figure in the writing world, but her recent behavior has solidified my drive to never touch a single thing she has or ever will produce. Honestly don't care how masterfully it's written, if the writer has harmful beliefs, it'll bleed into the product in one form or another. That new mystery novel about the gender nonconforming murderer is soaked with it.
And I don't see it as cancel culture personally- JK is a massively successful person with probably enough money to last 5 more lifetimes. She is still getting book deals. She has a video game releasing centered around her creation. She has a theme park. She has people bending over backwards to defend and rationalize her words. She's still succeeding. I'm just making the personal choice to avoid someone who thinks people like me are confused and need fixing, and distancing myself from others who tolerate that belief.
There's precedent for writers and other artists using their fame and influence to get into politics, start harmful social movements, or both. It's never too early to abort these things, is what I mean.
You can like the Harry Potter series and NOT like JK Rowling. series =/= author imo.
Throwing away precious childhood memories because some add-on DLC that happened years later shouldn't change the past.
It's like enjoying Last of Us but not liking Last Of Us 2 XD or playing Pokemon Red but not Pokemon Sword.
We just need to set our own line for when the journey ends.
I think its pretty stupid, honestly. Like there's more hot button issues at hand than a wealthy writer whose swimming in money at least a decade and half past her golden years when she was still relevant. Reminds me of all the times the internet tried canceling notch and it didn't do jackshit. Just don't give them money or publicity if you want them to fade into obscurity. All this is doing is making more people buy her work for the outrage.
