What are the problems with "female" armor?

[Zaboem]

I remember many years ago that a suit of plate armor was discovered in an old basement in France. The speculation at the time was that the suit may have been built for and used by Joan of Arc. On what was this speculation based? Were there any names or distinguishing religious icons on it? Nope, it looked completely normal and undistinctive for that time period. The reason it was associated with Joan was simply its size. That is the defining characteristic of female armor. An average woman cannot take an average suit of mass produced armor in any style that was engineered for an average man and fill it well. Two inches less in height equates to huge difference in mass.

[nostalgicroxas]

That reminds me why the silk road was so important - silk fabric is one of the materials whose woven strength can stand up to puncture from swords/lances and still breathes so you don't cook alive in it.

[chickknightgreenleaf]

also the "western armour is heavy and cumbersome" is totally absurd
here a video to debunk that

the only real problem with western amour is that they trap a lot of body heat, so you character need to carry a lot of water when wearing it

[Zaboem]

Nostalgicroxas, I don't think you mean "stand up to" exactly. Silk cloth was used underneath Mongolian armors. The purpose of silk specifically for the Mongolians was not to block the point of an arrow but to wrap around the arrowhead. It made extraction easier and less damaging. Anyway, that is the way I heard it.

[unknown_user]

@Samuraiflame The last picture is the best one XD

About breasts protection... maybe its a bit out of topic, but I've recalled, then when I've visited club of knife fighting, we have used them on training and competitions. There are different kinds of them, for example:

QP Sport Protection - Leaders in mens & womens chest guards

So, I think that knight-style armor for women may contain a special design part for this purpose as well, since women brests are bigger and more vulnerable than mens.
And in general... it is obvious that female armor should protect all body parts, which male armor does. But it is also obvious why many of fantasy authors don't follow this rule.

[nostalgicroxas]

Probably. I recall seeing it on some documentary about the silk road or Asian warfare. The picture I'm remembering is that a linen tunic cut with a sword would be decimated by the tearing both to the eye and under the microscope, and the silk tunic would show less damage and still be mostly intact under the microscope. It was something specifically about how plant fibers Europe was using would breakdown and be impossible to repair, while the silk could be patched easily without further damaging the garment.
Interestingly, I recall something like this in various fantasy games - where the "base starting out" armors are all cotton and hemp, and the mid-top tier armors are silken.

This kind of reminds me how sailcloth is such an odd woven and treated material. It looks like waxed canvas but doesn't feel like it at all, and certainly doesn't behave like it.

[HGohwell]

I assume we're all reasonably familiar with Saber give Fate/Stay Night and the its like are one of the biggest anime franchises but for those who aren't:

This is one of the most practical versions of the female knight you can really get. Contrary to popular belief, skirts like this are not an issue to fight in unless they're floor length posing a trip risk. Petite coats have been shown of offer a decent amount of protection from swords and daggers, although less from projectiles. All her torso is covered and the curve deflects the blow. The large shoulders allow for a full range of movement and the half skirt protects her from attack from behind while anyone wanting to attack the vulnerable front as to come into the danger zone of her sword. How high up her neck the proection goes depends on the artist. And is also notable that while not being identical, it is not incredibly different to the male version:

Some of the Fate/ designs are more realistic/fanservicey than others but Saber generally has a decent amount of armour.

Heels are not as bad as people believe. A low heel, as you say, isn't a big deal. And lets face it, in battle you're generally not running far, especially if you're in armour. I don't know how many people here have ever seen ballroom dancers, but I doubt you're going to be going to be doing much more balancing than that. If you're riding a horse, a decent heel is 110% vital. There's a reason riding boots all have a heel, even if not a huge one. Flat shoes are not good for your either.

[chickknightgreenleaf]

well, silk does produced a lot of friction, and the Japanese use it to create a kind of anti-arrow cloak called "horo" the cloak will blow up like a parachute when they riding and thus when pursuing enemy shoot arrow at the samurai the parachute will have chance to caught the arrow, using a principle similar to today kevlar vest. it even had been tested by the mythbuster

[chickknightgreenleaf]

ah yes, if anyone want to design female armour but still want to keep the realism then Saber is a good base model

[TAMAnnoying]

Ahhhh! I just recently found some really good vids on this (and i want people to watch more of this boi so even tho weve already talked about it im linking him anyways)

First

and second

And heres a bonus!

I very much agree with most of his points. Boob armor is perfectly fine and when done well it looks wonderful and really brings out the form of a women which is what they did back in the day to males with male armor, considering most of these conversations pop up cause of fantasy my answer is HECK WITH IT! ITS fantasy! so long as you're reasoninings for boob armor are internally consistent its fine ^^

The only thing i cant really find in the videos relating to what you mentioned is heels. I dont think they used heels for male armor and i have a feeling they wouldn't use it for females either, as heels originally where used for high fashion for men (yes men!) Most royalty wore them both because it was fancy and because it made them look taller before women and common folk started to adopt them into their every day fashion. Tho in a fantasy setting... again anything goes but i personally would NEVER put heels (that where not at least thick and stable) on my peeps in armor, male or female, heels are awful for balance, maneuvering and running which are important parts to any knight that wasn't on horse back (altho i suppose if you never got off your horse in combat it wouldn't be THAT big of a deal)

Battle dresses are fine but i personally hate the aesthetic of them for the simple fact you got a bunch of cloth flying around your legs and could cause balancing issues as well as give your enemy more things to try and grab and trip you up with. Not to mention simply most women like joan of arch and other women just... simply put on male armor.

aaannnnnd I did make a comic about this way way back in the college years (shameless self permotion https://tapas.io/episode/107964 ) It was more for fun and to prove that they should give me a degree so... i would no longer call it my best work, but im still really proud of it.

I love this thread btw Doki <3

[Azifri]

If you've ever worn armor or a corset, you have probably realized that those things are rigid but your body is squishy. Having a cup shaped breastplate sounds like the silliest thing to have, because you risk the uneven parts press against your boobs when you move, which will hurt. Also, back then breast support wasn't like today, and it would not give the cup shaped chest that you see nowadays. Most importantly, as far as I can remember, the historical found female armors had no difference in chest shape. It was a general size thing mostly.

[LordVincent]

This all the way!! This is the point i make whenever topics of "sexist clothing/sexualization of women in media" comes up: the clothing and bodytypes themselves aren't sexist. Unrealistic? Yeah sure. But it is fiction.
The sexism lies in whether or not characters of all genders are treated the same.

[dailysketchartist]

As depicted by Travis Hanson on DeviantArt:

[mrtoontastic]

There's no problem with it. It's not meant to be practical. It's not meant to make sense. if you don't want it to feel a way, you make your own. If you just don't care, and just want uniquely designed characters, then that's that. It's fantasy. It doesn't need to make sense. The more you make fantasy like reality, the less inspired things get.

[simplykit]

well for me, the problem sometimes is that you cant tell if ts a dude or a chick

for example, i was planning to draw warrior twins

when i finished it, i didnt realize , i couldn't tell which is the female here...

[skicoak]

I just had to design some armor for female guards and admittedly this it barely more reasonable than bikini armor ... but sometimes practical just doesn't work in regards to visual design.

But I tried not to make it about sex appeal.

[nostalgicroxas]

I'd utilize the designs in the armor to tell male from female apart in that kind of example. Like maybe the woman has more plant motifs on her armor embossed in, while the man has geometric patterns. That's how Japanese kimono and yukata work - girls get flowers and vibrant colors, men get muted gray/navy/green and large geometric patterns (largely fat stripes, or diamonds/orbs clustered in some areas).

[MK_Wizard]

Well number one, it should actually protect the girl. Aside from it being too exposed, high heels are a hazard (one falls move and you can twist your ankle, not to mention they aren't for all terrain) and such armor could be hazardous even for the wearer (it could cut into the girl).

Now keep in mind... I myself make heroines with unrealistic battle clothing, but I also do the same with guys. A tuxedo is not practical wear for a battle field even though it does keep the guy covered. I think the one true problem is what you are comfortable with drawing and writing. If you bring too much reality into a fantasy, it stops being fun and unless, you aim to be realistic and practical with your armour designs, sit back and have fun. And keep in mind with this, even if you did draw them realistically, people would still see fault.

So when it comes to clothing, don't ask yourself what will make others happy. Ask yourself, what makes you happy and comfortable?

[gh0stcr33p]

I guess the real problem is that the female armor is usually less practical and skimpier than male armor in most media just to appeal to the audience... for my comic I try to keep the male and female armors similar. of course they have their differences, but one isn't exactly more revealing than the other. they're still not exactly practical, but it's fantasy so I just go with designs that I like

[Cavechan]

I will respectfully disagree with this chart. I'm probably thinking too much into this since I get it's supposed to be simplistic, but context does matter. The quality of the characters, the way they act, the world they live in, the situations they're in, author intention, etc etc all play a role if a woman wearing skimpy armor and a man wearing full armor is "sexist". Things aren't so black and white.