What's your opinion on tourism?

[Kelheor]

Today it's impossible to travel to see a wonder of nature or a historical ancient work of art with the same experience as, say, just over a century ago.

Well, yes, but almost a century ago you hardly could go anywhere, but another part of your town. Maybe the neighboring village. (I overstate a bit, but ya know, not too much)
I agree that there's nothing good in tourism like you described it, but you either sit at home or go places you want and try to behave your best to not be that "buy shit-make a photo-destroy one of the world's wonders" tourist and enjoy the views.
You also can go to non-so-famous landmarks! Like there are like a million shrines in China, but noooo, everyone goes to Tiantan in Beijing. It's not even that great looking (judging by photos, I've never been to Beijing, but saw better shrines in other parts of China). Of course it's kinda still the same, but at least not that many people and merch.
If someone let me go to the mysterious city of Shangri-La, I would =) Without buying magnets, without harming landmarks and all that, but trying my best to behave like I should in the local culture. Just because I'm filled with admiration for everything beautiful in the world.
(also if this sounded like I've been to many places - no, no I wasn't at all)

[unknown_user]

Different kinds of tourism exist. That one, which you've described, doesn't cause me sympathy either. It's just business and vanity fair.
But as @Kelheor said, you can choose where, when and how you will travel and which adventures you'll go to by yourself.

[Cavechan]

I don't really care about a place being a tourist trap, but it becomes a problem when the tourists are being disrespectful and actually causing harm. Like when I was in Japan and at Fushimi Inari shrine. Super popular and crowded which in itself is not a problem, but when people are walking with selfie sticks and taking videos of themselves just walking, then it is a problem. And they are walking SLOWLY, slower than everyone else who is trying to just get through the tiresome uphill walk. They actually become a disturbance and in the way. Some places have banned selfie sticks altogether.

I have also heard Uluru is now closed to tourists because it is a sacred area for the people living there and that was also causing disruptions and trash to gather and destroying the landmark.

[HGohwell]

And that not even covers the shitty nature of the tourists themselves, with the whole "I'll just break off a piece of the Gret Pyramid to take home with me" bullshit behavior.

Actually this and what you're talking about go hand in hand so you sorta have to talk about it because what you're saying about them being behind barriers and guarded is because of that attitude. You can't get anywhere near them because of that.

Now, obviously no one wants these great natural wonders to fall into ruin and not be appreciated so some form of tourism is needed, especially for things that need a lot of upkeep. this is why over here a lot of old grand manor houses and castles are now open to the public, because it costs a fortune just to keep them from collapsing, never mind in some kind of historically appreciative state. I'd assume a lot of other wonders do need some kind of up keep that isn't cheap. So there is an element of commercialism needed.

Now, people have been defacing and vandalizing things since the beginning of time, that is not a modern thing. We have ancient Roman graffiti preserves in places like Pompeii. So that attitude is not new. Relics, aka stealing things from dead people or sometimes even the dead people, has been a religious thing since forever too, after all. In many ways pilgrimage was the original tourism and I'm sure a lot of people were doing the olden days equivalent of what we do now, but since everything was slower, it was slower. There's a relativity that has to be taken into account.

There is of course, the argument that ease of access and cheapness cheapens the experience. If you want them to be revered, you have to make them special. Make them cost a fortune, make it so they're not easy to get to.

But also, I'll admit some things just aren't worth the hype. Things like the Mona Lisa (I know I'm a heretic) just aren't that interest, and I'm not sure why it's considered so beautiful, so I was sorta meh when everyone got in a fluff over whoever it was just went there to take selfies. How does that tiny little painting that isn't that much more beautiful than a lot of other paintings of similar time ever live up to all the hype? And there are plenty of things like that. I used to live near Stone Henge, back when you could get near it before it was taped off because of graffiti. It was meh. Venice, unless you like canals a lot, is meh. We went to see "voted the most beautiful city in the world" in the Canary Islands, drove up hairpin bends on cliffs and you know what? It was a few houses and a few shrubs over looking the sea! It was awful. Compared to the scenery we drove through to get there, including the stunning barren lands of Mt Teide.

The problem is, the modern world is changing and if these places can't keep up they will die out. I used to live in a seaside tourist town. We made all our income in 3 months of the year. Do you know what would happen to that town if we couldn't keep up with what the tourists wanted? The same thing that's happening all over with seaside towns; people have to move away, the spare houses are filled with people who need government housing but none in the cities so they're sent to fill out these spaces, but there are no jobs in the area so the entire town becomes a town of people without jobs. Now, perhaps it would take longer and not be as extreme in some these big places, but if you don't tell people to come, they won't come and tourism is a driving force in many economies.

Perhaps that's not the right or moral thing, but I don't think we should hate people for trying to make a living and the people who provide that living. And it's the way it's always been, lets not forget a lot of ancient landmarks were created so people would come and see them and spend money.

Today it's impossible to travel to see a wonder of nature or a historical ancient work of art with the same experience as, say, just over a century ago.

There are plenty of nature wonders left over here, idk about where you are. We have entire huge areas dedicated to the natural beauty of things and most of the tourism industry there is B&Bs so people can appreciate the unspoiled natural beauty of it. There are no guys in Hawaiin shirts, there are people in walking boots and coats preparing to hike the hills or go boating on the lakes. They're people there to appreciate the beauty and I'm sorry if wherever you are isn't like that.

[Zaboem]

Actually, I think we might all be better off if there was a little more tourism. I know that when a crowd is crowding around an attraction at peak time, it can seem like everybody in the world is visiting. Actually, the vast majority of people don't. I heard a statistic on NRP that 14% of Americans have ever set foot outside their home country. That's the exact same percentage as Romans during the Roman imperial age. I don't imagine that most developed nations have a much higher percentage than that, and it must be even lower within underdeveloped nations.

[Mari]

What makes you so important that you should be able to see things but others shouldn't? That's what this sounds like to me. When I was in tuscany I took a train on my own to firenze, and yeah there were a lot of people touring the cathedrals, but what of it? I still saw the cathedrals. I met interesting people.

My favourite part of the trip wasn't the cathedrals, but when me and my friend came back to the back end of nowhere hotel we were staying in (it was like...super rural tuscany.) we took an old rail carriage up a mountain. I mean old. No seatbelts or nuthing, only room for 4 people. Me and my friends were the only ones riding it at that time of night, and we decided to go on the outside railing to watch the climb. super scary. bitch was going nearly vertical and only thing keeping us on the cart was the flimsy railing. The view up was breathtaking. No one was up there. We danced and sang and goofed around for an hour.

If you can't enjoy visiting a country because there are other people there, it's your own issue. Tourism is good for the economy, and funds the upkeep of important buildings.

[Darth_Biomech]

What makes you so important that you should be able to see things but others shouldn't?

That's not what I said though? Like, at all?

[raulvpcandido]

Yes, I'm totally agree with this. I'm brazilian and I live in a touristic region of my country and people thinks they are owners of the space doing bad things, disrespecting local laws or destroying the nature. besides that, we have a problem with some people thinks here everything is crazy (maybe sometimes LOL), but is not the case of everything! I love when I see tourists making they trips with respect about different cultures!!

[Mari]

@Darth_Biomech

Complaining about there being other people is essentially just that, though. I feel like you should also point out that tourists breaking off pieces of the great pyramids was common practice around 100 years ago and that it's not something that is allowed, or something that happens, nowadays. If you didn't know, tours in egypt happen with armed guards because of the unrests in egypt and how common place kidnapping tourists is.

[Kelheor]

If you didn't know, tours in egypt happen with armed guards

...but there were Dutch tourists having sex on it in 2018 and one Russian guy climbed it at night and took the photos in 2013 and the same 2013 some Chinese guy wrote his name on the wall of temple in Egypt =) Sure there are not many people who do those things, but well, there are people who think it fun to commemorate their lame handwriting on a thousands years old temple. I bet the same people won't mind to have a piece of the pyramid. Well, this is a hard topic overall and people should just behave.

[vothnthorvaldson]

A lot of things were already said that I fully agree on (especially about maintenance costs, and the social importance of travelling) but I'll add a bit to this one:

One can discover so much more by avoiding touristic spots anyway. Even out of season when it's quiet everywhere, I don't really do large spots anymore.

I get the attractiveness of famous landmarks, museums etc. I understand that some people (that includes me) are frustrated that they can't enjoy things that they are truly fascinated by, or even have studied, because hords of only slighly interested people are blocking the way.

But the thing is, it's likely that there is a landmark/museum just near that you never heard of, or know less, that is as fascinating, and sometimes as historically, culturally (etc.) significant. Quieter, often cheaper, and possibly more interesting, as instead of seeing for real things that you most likely have seen in picture (and may be able to browse the collections of, online, 360°), this is all new things to discover.

For eg., I've been numerous times in Paris/Paris region, but never went to the Louvres or Versailles or any of these huge spots. But I've been to many, many smaller museums and got incredible experiences there. My favorite memory is sitting on the wooden floor of the last floor of the Gustave Moreau museum, looking at binders full of preparatory works. Impossible in bigger museums! This museum is still a relatively famous one, too. Just not very known by random tourists, more by Moreau enthusiasts.

I do sometimes go to more touristic places because it's of specific interest to me. Generally, it can be done in relative peace by timing properly the visit (very true for counyries/regions with huge seasonal differences). But obviously it's not always possible to plan ahead so much. I'm going to try the Bayeux Tapestries next winter, I'm putting it off since years. It's not THAT touristy, but it's not a big museum, so it can get clogged up easily.

Now, nothing, NOTHING excuses dirty tourists letting their trash everywhere, or all the 'Why would I care? I'm not home!' attitude! (I won't discuss politeness, because what's polite or not change so much depending on cultures. All what I see could be done on this aspect is to encourage tourists to read one of these little books on social conventions for the country they are going to).

[yansusu]

Now, I'm probably biased here since I'm a tourist about once a year or every second year. To me, it's important to be able to go places and see them with my own eyes. It's different from just seeing them on TV or reading about them in a book even though I also like doing those things. In fact, just taking a week or two reading up about all the sights I am going to visit soon is half of the fun.

That said, I could naturally do with less other tourists hanging around. Especially so if they're the rude folk that will litter the place, behave disruptive toward other people and, well, are what most people imagine tourists to be like.
I can also do without those overpriced, mass-produced souvenirs but it's the locals that sell those to earn money, right? I'd still go to the shop in a museum to get a book or something similar though. Because that is something that holds value to me and lets me re-live the vacation I had and learn something I didn't know before. It's just as much a part of the experience as the information gathering beforehand.

Overall, because of what I've seen, I think there are lots of different types of tourists and it might be a bit unfair to think of all of them in the same way. I have also seen some places that deal really well with tourists that don't behave well and thus don't seem like they're crawling with them even though they're still swamped (thinking of that stone church in Helsinki right now).
Also, tourism is often also important for the economy since lots of places live off of it afaik. So I don't think it's all bad. It's just that people's attitudes when they visit another place need to change and places need to implement more regulations, maybe, to make sure those people don't behave badly.

[Mari]

Look, I'm not saying there's not 1 or 2 douchebags that may do it, I'm just trying to combat the japes and misinformation from the OP that makes it seem like every tourist that visits egypt is breaking a piece off.

[Darth_Biomech]

Complaining about there being other people is essentially just that, though.

I didn't? I complained about how the places were turned from places of cultural heritage to places of commerce and tourist milking? All those lots of people are the consequence, not the cause. People nowadays travel overseas just to have a nice weekend. I never understood that. For me, travel to another city is almost an expedition that one should prepare for in advance, much less to the whole another country or continent. An adventure! I personally feel that it gives that trip much more meaning. But some people travel to just basically fill up a checklist "100 places you need to visit before you die".

[DokiDokiTsuna]

Nothing mysterious and grandiose has been left in these places, the whole atmosphere has been vulgarized and destroyed by hordes of fat guys in Hawaiian shirts with cameras, and another horde of merchants trying to make a quick buck selling overpriced stuff to those fat guys.

...Y'know what this reminds me of? That story about Jesus driving the merchants out of the temple (if you've ever read the Bible, you know what I'm talking about~) XD

So yeah, as others have said, none of this is new. Not the attitude of the tourists, or that of the people forced to put up with them. ^^;

Furthermore, I think it's just natural. People tend to flock to beautiful things, or at least to where other people flock, and merchants will always go where the people are. It's just the way it is. The best we can do is try to be clean and respectful, no matter which group we're in: natives, tourists, or merchants.

If you want a more "unspoiled" experience, you can always try national park tourism (again, as other people have said) or try looking for 'hidden gems' instead of going to the same handful of landmarks where all the tourists go. There are lots of beautiful things in this world, and many of them are hardly ever talked about, let alone visited.

I heard a statistic on NRP that 14% of Americans have ever set foot outside their home country.

Call it a sign of the times, but I feel compelled to point out that a large percentage of Americans right now couldn't even scrape $1000 together in an emergency...and you're gonna need at least that much to go traveling overseas for, like, more than 1 day. And that's IF you can even get vacation time.

Maybe among other developed countries, it's an issue of "lazy modern people need to get off their asses and see the world" but here I think there's a little more to it than that...

[vothnthorvaldson]

It's likely a very complex issue with many interactions. I know a few people locally who never went to an other province (that's Canada). A trip to the next province is probably around $200 gas for most densly inhabited areas, most people have that here (I don't say everyone is rich but the economy is very good locally right now). A lot never went outside of the country or to far away provinces.

Everyone has their own reasons, but one interesting thing that I found out when speaking to some of them, is that they don't see the point of traveling at all, but often note that their family (as, recent ancestors) never felt the need, and anyhow couldn't, so they don't see why they would have the need. The thing is, their ancestors could probably not, financially or logistically. They can, but the familial history still has an impact.
This may not be a common example (I'm in a place where most non-Native Canadians started coming only 100 years ago, so a very short Canadian family history), but I find it interesting in showing how it's not only the conditions in 2020 that impact the traveling habits of some people.

[yansusu]

Maybe among other developed countries, it's an issue of "lazy modern people need to get off their asses and see the world" but here I think there's a little more to it than that...

I think even in other countries, the same still holds true for many people. Although it might be even more difficult in America. And I guess a lot depends on where you come from and want to go and, well, your income.

For example, my family (Germany) is able to go to someplace in Europe for five days or a week if I find us a good bargain which means flight + hotel + at least one meal a day must be below 1000€ for two people altogether. That's doable but depending on the destination not always easy. The big cities are often super expensive.
Then there's also stuff you have to take into consideration, like: Where is the hotel and what do you want to see? Will you be able to even get there? I normally travel with my mother who doesn't have a driver's license but would freak out if I rented a car (I do have a license though). So it's always getting around by bus/train/metro whatever there is. But that also means the hotel can't be far away from everything. I mean if you need five hours to get to the destination and five to get back ... where does that leave room to see anything?

This is also something that limits the things you can go see as well. Like, I'd definitely go see some stuff that's not totally swamped with other tourists but those are attractions you often can't get to with the public transport. So it's not always that easy to accomplish. In fact, I see it as kind of a privilege to have your own car to get around.

Personally, I would love to go and see Quebec but that's like 1k+ for just one person with flight and hotel so completely impossible Ah, damn, I want a job where I can make lots of money

[ignika1998]

This just sounds like you had a bad experience on vacation one time and never got over it tbh. As someone who lives in a country who's economy relies heavily on tourism, and as a tourist myself I can tell you that tourism is great. You may not like it, but it has massive benefits for the country and its visitors.

Tourism can boost a countries economy and therefore improve the lives of the locals. Not to mention that people who travel often gain a much greater understanding of the world and end up with a much more open mind. Sure, there will always be people being disrespectful and making fools of themselves. But I think you should try and look at the benefits of tourism instead. As I believe they more than make up for a few rude tourists.

[gh0stcr33p]

to make it short: I really hate tourism as well

[indagold]

I don't hate tourism, it helps with the economy in some places and you're giving money back to the natives depending where you go. I live in nyc, the biggest tourism spot in the world so I have a better idea of it than most people and the problem I have is that the mayor cares more about keeping up appearances with tourists than actually taking care of the city. Outside boroughs get ignored in favor of manhattan, queens got hit by a tornado a decade ago and everyone just ignored it because queens isn't tourist friendly. I don't like prices get inflated just to appeal to some person from another place either.

But sometimes its cool cause I was hanging out with my friend in another country and every place was closed for the holidays except the tourist spots so we got to eat out instead of going home lol