Meaning? How do I do it?

Princessmossy 2016-12-23 23:01:13 UTC #1

Hello this isn't about comics so I don't know if it actaully belongs here but you guys always give great advice and I would love help on this.

I am in an ib art class and it is very hard as it's supposed to be. But for me the reason it's so hard is because I cannot give my teacher what she wants. She wants me to put meaning into my pieces and the thing is she never explained how to do that. I'd like to just draw what I like but she is making it increasingly hard for me to start because everything needs to mean something in the piece. How do I apply meaning to a piece? It's very frustrating when she asks me why I used the colour yellow and have no idea other than "it looked cool" or "it worked with the piece." I just wish she'd exsplain how in a way I can understand because I just don't understand. It comes so easily to everyone else in the class... she says "you'll get better with practice" (although this isn't really a skill I'm interested in learning or will likely use once I'm done with the class as comic making doesn't really require EVERYTHING to have a meaning of some kind.) and then she turns around and just expects me to know how to do it. Sorry I'm just really frustrated.

SleepingPoppy 2016-12-23 23:32:55 UTC #2

It would be nice if your teacher gave you a bit more guidelines on what she wanted. However, this doesn't have to be that hard. The meaning doesn't have to be deep and complicated, especially if you're not used to working this way. Break it down!

I can't speak for what your teacher wants, but if I was you I would pick a "concept" of some kind, then brain storm different ways to visually convey your concept. For example, "isolation" could be a princess leaning out the window of a tower. Or it could be a tiny blue square on a white piece of canvas, or a crowded room with one person somehow disengaged via body language/coloring/style. Color? Well our princess could be staring out at sunset- the sun going down is another day without rescue, while the sun coming up would be more hopeful! Keep colors cooler for feelings of sadness, and warmer for, well, a warmer feeling.

Also, ask your teacher for advice as you go. That best way to avoid the "What does this yellow mean?" "Yellow.. ness.." is if you ask her for color suggestions before you start. She can't find meaning for you in a work with none, but she can help you create a piece of work based on an actual meaning.

Ha, I'm sorry, I don't know how helpful that is, but I hope it gives you a way to move forward.

Cielle 2016-12-24 00:07:18 UTC #3

@SleepingPoppy gave some really good advice for giving real meaning to your art, so I'm going to present you with another option: lie. Make stuff up. I don't recommend doing this often (lying isn't a great thing to do), but sometimes you have to tell teachers what they want to hear. Why did you choose yellow? "Because the warm hues remind me of butter, sunshine, dandelions. It makes me think of summer and warmth, and I wanted to convey those feelings in this piece." Doesn't matter if that has nothing to do with why you chose yellow. You just have to justify it for the teacher. Maybe you'll find a genuine answer along the way, but when in doubt: fake it til you make it.

You could also pull the old "I don't want to tell you how this should make you feel. What does it mean to YOU, sensei?". This probably won't fly for an IB art class, though, unless you are really close with your teacher. I recommend you read up on what some other artists have said about their work, or perhaps what other art specialists/critics have said about art. That will help you learn the language and how people talk about meaning and art. A great place to start IMO is with Picasso's blue period. It's very abstract, but it's also not that hard to understand what he was trying to convey. Perhaps looking at other pieces of art and reflecting on what you think the meaning is will help you think about a)how to put meaning into your own art or b)how to tell your teacher what she wants to hear about the meaning of your art.

shazzbaa 2016-12-24 00:52:21 UTC #4

And it could be that those choices work, but you just need to know how to describe them better. I don't know your teacher, but I suspect that if she asks "why are these lights here?" the answer "they looked pretty" will never really fly, but the answer "they make the scene feel more warm and homey" or "they work with the other bright colours to make the piece feel energetic" might go over better. Even a piece that just looks cool has some reason it makes you feel good. It might be partially an issue of being able to put your finger on WHY your choices work, and partially an issue of pondering a little before you make a choice rather than just going with your gut.

And that is something that's useful in comics, because your gut isn't always right. Knowing why you would make a choice is extremely useful for troubleshooting -- "why isn't this angle working? well, hm, what does this choice do for the piece emotionally? it's shot from above, and that tends to be a less emotional angle. If I want the character to really feel powerless I could make the angle from down low, looking up, and make his opponent seem to loom over him." This sort of thinking comes up in comics for me very often.

So maybe some part of it will be using yellow because it looks rad, and then figuring out -- well, why does the yellow look rad? Is it because it makes bright, contrasting colours that give your drawing a lot of energy? Is it because it feels warmer and cozier? -- and some part of it will be reaching outside your comfort zone to actually think over your choices before you implement them. How do you want this piece to feel, and what kind of colour scheme, composition, etc. leads to that feeling?

That said, I think finding your balance between @SleepingPoppy's advice and @Cielle's advice is gonna be up to you. Sometimes you do your best and still discover that a teacher is just not interested in working with the kind of artist that you are.... and you have to either try to create the kinds of things they want to see, or create what you want and learn how to describe it convincingly. Both skills can come in handy!

Kura 2016-12-24 01:44:40 UTC #5

@Cielle making shit up is honestly how I did it with some of the really spacy art teachers I would get from time to time.

I don't know if you're teacher is one of them, but there seems to be a sub category of art teachers where the concept "art is a form of expressing your emotions" is taken to EXTREME levels. To the point where technique, composition, layout and details actually get you bad marks because "You're technique is good but I don't SEE any EMOTION in it" That's when you start making shit up on the spot and do the "Well this line here represents the feeling of sadness, and this blue colour here is reflecting the thoughts of the character reacting to that sadness" or some made up shit like that and their opinion suddenly changes to "OMG!!!! I can see it now!!!!"

spadesart 2016-12-24 02:59:04 UTC #6

I took ap art for 2 years and I bullshitted every single artist comment. You can nitpick useless details like "I used a lot of yellow here to reflect (emotion that kind of fits the piece) (something about the human experience)" like this one piece

won first place in a local competition for ap students and i drew it because i thought it looked rad in my head but i put in the artist comments something about how the character tried to find the key to immortality but when he did he lost all his memories and emotions and the piece shows the event happening (and then some obligatory technical stuff about the design because this ALMOST won a show before it but didnt because i didnt explain how i used the ~~~~~elements and principles of design~~~~~ in the piece)

i got a 5 on the ap exam doing this

indagold 2016-12-24 03:14:53 UTC #7

pftftftft oh please. Asking to find meaning is ludicrous. It's art let it be what it is.

I took a drawing class for freshman year of art college with some modern art teacher and put no effort into the projects because I never got to draw from life, just boring arts and crafts. She loved the messy unclean look and found it "deep" and "passionate" and I lied and acted like it was super deep. Then we were forced to do gluing paper together so I drew rabbits on it and that was one of the few times I had fun. She was enraged and said I wasn't taking the piece seriously, it has no meaning and gave me a B-.

Art teachers, you gotta love them.

hushicho 2016-12-24 05:20:49 UTC #8

I've seen some really good and insightful thoughts here. I thought I'd weigh in with a few of my own.

Art, I believe, is at its best when it is an expression; whether it's one's personal perspective that one is attempting to convey to someone outside that perspective and perception, or whether it's a more emotive -- or even perfunctory -- gesture, it should express something.

That said, though, expression doesn't have to be something profound or sound "deep" to serve its purpose. Sometimes the purpose behind a piece, and its meaning, are simply because one found motivation to create along certain lines. Sometimes a piece of art is to express strong emotion or profound feeling, and other times it is something that the artist just felt like doing. However, it's essential that any artist, or teacher for that matter, remember that the real meaning of art is going to be different for each individual. The person experiencing the art is connecting in some way with the artist, but they also bring their own distinct perspective to it, and that will color their interpretation of it. It doesn't matter if it's pop art, impressionism, or a comic book.

If your teacher is a good one, she'll probably understand that sometimes you just use a color because it suits the piece. The Dadaists, for example, made a whole movement out of lack of meaning, which is noteworthy. I would suggest engaging your teacher and talking to her more when these questions come up -- it's not a one-way dialogue, this should be a conversation. I find a lot of artists who are that enthusiastic about meaning will usually enjoy being engaged in a conversation about it. You shouldn't be afraid to ask her about meaning herself, and what art means to her. Speaking to her about perspective, meaning, and purpose behind art can be very illuminating, especially since every artist is a little different in their approach to expression.

She might not be great. She might turn out to be one of those art teachers we all find intolerable because of a singular, narrow-minded idea of what makes art. But she might just as likely turn out to be a friend, a guide, and someone who can really give you a lot to think about in terms of creating art and giving it meaning when otherwise you may not have thought about it at all. It's worth a try!

joannekwan 2016-12-24 10:03:32 UTC #9

Yep, bullshitting is like 20% of adult life. You just gotta know how to talk the talk to get what you want, basically. And especially in art, who's to say that yellow doesn't represent the nostalgia you have for your childhood? It's so subjective I don't think they'll question you too much after you give an answer like that.

And deep down you may have good reasons for doing things in your art, sometimes subconsciously, but can't articulate why very well. I'm like this pretty often with my work and I let more insightful people pick it apart in analysis and many a time I find myself agreeing with them.

Devika 2016-12-24 12:56:51 UTC #10

I've been in similar art classes, and I agree with the others in this thread. Basically, there are two things for you to do: 1. Learn to make a piece around a concept. 2. Learn to spew artistic BS. You're probably going to need both.

Number 1 is a skill that will be useful to you in any piece of art you make, especially comics. Knowing why something works is very important for reaching that next level in your art and really make the art connect with the audience. Basically, you need to think about how every aspect (perspective, color, values) can be used to convey a certain concept, like fear for example. If you keep this in mind during the whole process you won't be at loss for an answer when your teacher wants an explanation, and your pieces will probably pack a stronger punch once you get the hang of it! Ideally, this "thinking through" is what your teacher wants to teach you.

Now, number 2. Some teachers just need to hear certain things. Some art teachers force this on their students in order to justify their art classes as something more than doodling, in other words, they have an inferiority complex. Others have a superiority complex and you need to feed their idea of how great art is. You might be lucky and have a teacher who is willing to genuinely teach you how to give meaning to a piece, but sometimes it just helps to make some shit up. Really, our grades were heavily influenced by our ability to BS some deep meaning into stuff, and not just in art class... (One word. Goethe.) Basically, give up the idea of needing to be honest about what you really thought. xD

punkarsenic 2016-12-24 15:16:41 UTC #11

ugh. i hate this part of art courses.

she means, like, symbolism. and purpose. typically political or psychological. like, you draw some fairies - youre exploring the childhood psyche, maybe write some shit about growing up or innocence. you paint a sunset - youre using natural form to consider the beauty in endings and how people understand death. its really just writing some bullshit you can link back to whatever you want to create.

you can also start with a concept - 'i want to make an art piece about homophobia, so im going to research art abt homophobia etc and then im going to paint footballs pink. or something' in some ways, ~meaning makes it easier to get good marks. some of my highest marks in GCSE were drawing in a bible. eugh.

if you really dont want to give everything a ~meaning~ (fair enough) you have one Get Out Free Card that i can think of: aestheticism. Oscar Wilde coined the concept, that things could be beautiful for the sake of being beautiful. if you do a page spread on that, then look at some designers you like the look of, then bada bing bada boom - fuck meaning, do what you like.

good luck, IB art sounds like a death sentence to me

Princessmossy 2016-12-24 22:06:53 UTC #12

Your all so great! This is why I love this website lmao! I am definitely going to take this all into consideration. And yeah IB art feels like a death sentence too.
So if I wanted to do less realism art in college what should I do? Should I take a normal art course or should I take animation? Or is there any other options for art courses? I haven't seen any comic art classes but maybe I just don't know where to look. Any suggestions? I want to make comics for a career so maybe something that will help with that.

JustMarshma 2017-01-06 13:14:31 UTC #13

Well, personally, I think it's kind of important for art to be cohesive. If you look at great works of music and literature, every note and every word is selected to evoque a certain emotion. Maybe try thinking about it on those lines. So if you are painting a tree, for example. Think about why you are painting the tree and how you feel about the tree, so that when you paint you have that emotion in mind. If you see an old tree and you make yellow a strong color, then when you are asked, you can say "Well, because yellow light means it's around midday, when you are most tired, just like the tree because it's so old and still, it makes you feel sleepy". It does get better with practice, but it's a good way to start, maybe you don't do a lot of philosophy or a deep analysis, but emotions are something we all have, so that's what we can all do. Also remember that just because you didn't think about somehting, doesn't mean there isn't a reason for you doing it without thinking, let's say you didn't deliberately thinking about the time of day, subconsciously you still felt that yellow was the right color to use.

shazzbaa 2017-01-06 18:28:10 UTC #14

Ah geez, sorry my answer's a bit long, but I hope some of this can be a little helpful!

First, recognise that college isn't a necessary given -- and I say this as someone who went to art school and really enjoyed it! Really consider whether art school is the best choice for you. This article talks about some alternatives, if it isn't something you'd considered, and I think it's a good read even if you ultimately decide to go.

The thing is that college is really expensive. For comics, webcomics especially, the ~DREAM~ is that you're makin just enough to live on your own and pay your bills. A simple degree might help for getting a day job, but as far as art education goes.... it might make sense for a doctor or a lawyer to take out huge loans, but it doesn't make sense to take out huge loans when your hope is just to make a modest living doing what you love.

I have a very dear creator friend who wanted to go to SCAD and study comics like I did, but her parents couldn't afford it, so she ended up going to a state college with a terrible art program. She didn't enjoy it. Her final project was a museum installation, it couldn't have been further from what she wanted to do. But now she's being paid a good wage as a colourist on a webcomic, she's the lead artist on a new virtual pet site, and she's setting up to finally publish her own original comic in book form.
I studied comics for four years at a major art college in a very good program, and she struggled through a terrible state art program, and yet we're equal in skill and both getting paid doing what we love. College doesn't make or break what you can do, as long as you're always drawing/creating, making contacts, and willing to learn. Art jobs rarely need to see that you majored in art -- they just want to see your portfolio.

But if you're confident that you can afford it and it's right for you ---

These are rare, but they exist! I majored in "Sequential Art" in college and I've seen other colleges offer a "Cartooning" major! But anything that improves your skills in draftsmanship and composition will translate in some way to comics, honestly. Even if it's not an exact match to what you want to do.

Every college is going to be different! For example, in our school, when people wanted to become illustrators or concept artists, we would always encourage them to quit their illustration classes and become a sequential art major instead, even if they didn't want to do comics --- because the illustration classes at our school never really taught you how to improve your drawing skills, and sequential classes would make you draw a LOT and teach you tons about composition and drawing well and quickly. But that was just my school -- other schools might have a really good illustration program!! Animation might be really good..... or it might shuffle you into Maya classes that don't translate to drawing skills at all. There's not gonna be a single buzzword you can watch for, it'll be different from school to school.

My advice is to visit the college you're interested in, and if you can, talk to professors or the people who run that department, and see if they make you excited to take their classes. Or when you've chosen a college, if you don't have to declare your major right away, go ahead and take a couple classes in the majors you're considering, meet the people who are in that major, and see if it's a place you fit in.
In my experience in art school, the best judge of which classes are going to be the best fit for you is actually... the people. My peers who were taking illustration classes but fit in better with the sequential kids would eventually express regret that they hadn't taken sequential classes instead, because illustration had never really been right for them. Kids not liking the people in the architecture department was the first red flag that maybe they weren't going to enjoy the architecture program. One architecture friend who felt that way took a photography class on a whim and suddenly discovered that, despite the fact that she'd never planned to major in that, she LOVED it, and ended up graduating with a beautiful portfolio as a commercial photographer.

So basically I guess... look for a place you can afford, because art isn't going to pay off massive debt, and look for a program that really excites you..... but if you do end up in classes that don't help you, or if that's the most affordable option for you, remember that that's not the end of the world either! The fact that you're here learning from other artists is honestly one of the biggest and most important part of making it as an artist! The only other part is just to keep creating as much as you can and pushing yourself to be better and better.

DMBrigman 2017-01-06 22:46:11 UTC #15

The reason why your teacher is asking you to explain the meaning of your pieces is she wants you to think about why you are making your choices. When you do art as a career you have to be aware of your audience and how your creative decisions affect how they interpret a piece. You also have to be able to talk about your piece and explain it to those who have finally approval.

I have worked doing graphic design, illustration, and training for many years and it is all about communicating ideas and concepts. Every choice from typeface, font weight, colors, composition, is all purposeful to achieve a specific objective. In fact, each assignment starts with a list of requirements, and an end goal. Every choice made must serve to get to the end goal and I must be able to explain/defend creative choices.

As for art school, I think it is a good idea to think about what you realistically need for your job. Art as a career is wonderful, but at the end of the day it is a job and there is a path from the bottom to the top. Once you discover what that is, find out if art school will really benefit you or if taking online courses and self study will be more beneficial. Ultimately, you only get out of school what you put into it and it does not guarantee success, only you can do that.

For comic art, draftsmanship, life drawing, color theory, cinematography, storyboarding, and art history are all classes that will help you. You will need to learn to draw nearly everything, and draw it well.