What if Tapas had a mentor program?

Merle 2017-09-27 16:33:57 UTC #2

That sounds very cool! The only problem I can see is people starting to fight to get the "best mentor" but it´s an very interesting concept! I could see this go a long way

LCT_m_a_d 2017-09-27 16:43:46 UTC #3

I think mentoring is absolutely a good method and one thats become underutilized.

I do feel artist should onus this kinda thing for themselves since taking that initiative and struggle to seek a mentor is valuable experience in it's own, but a program doesn't sound like a bad idea.

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 16:45:29 UTC #4

thats a good point. i think it would have to be set up so that placement was fairly random (with negotiation room so that mentors are matched with appropriate beginners) and also very private. so you'd only know if big name A was a better mentor than big name B if someone was breaking a hush hush agreement. there should also be checks and balances to make sure mentors are being helpful, which would help keep things fair.

kip 2017-09-27 16:53:50 UTC #5

This sounds awesome. I feel like a lot of potential problems can be talked though and solved with “trail periods”, getting more info about the people (time zones, age), by a third party organizer.
If you want help organizing this independently, I’m absolotuely down to help!

sarrowsmith10 2017-09-27 16:57:56 UTC #6

My only concern is that mentoring might take a lot of time and effort on the part of the mentor. Is there any incentive to become a mentor? I know lots of big names don't like it when random people try to be buddy-buddy with them, because they feel used only for their popularity.

I think that a mentor program should be created independently. Folks should "apply" for the mentorship. Make sure both parties are actively participating in the community and have specific goals for the mentorship. Otherwise I think you are going to be overwhelmed with inexperienced artists/writers with only a few mentors. I think there should be a time period as well. Like mentors volunteer for 6 months or something. That way if they want to do mentoring to several people, they have a chance to interact with more people.

Just thoughts.

Kayke 2017-09-27 16:59:25 UTC #7

I did something kind of like this when I was in college. I signed up to be an intern for one of my professors over the summer and basically I shadowed her in her studio and attended a convention with her (my first time tabling at a con!) and received feedback on the comic I was working on. In exchange for her time and advice I did flat colors, scanned stuff, took dictation, etc. This was a great experience for me and I learned a whole lot, but I think part of the reason it worked was because we were both really clear on what we wanted out of the experience. I'm also not sure how it would have worked out if it had not been in person, as most of the lessons I learned were just from watching her work... doing things she didn't even consider lessons like updating her blog, taking phone calls, answering emails, and organizing her workflow.

The issue I could see with the program would be that the apprentices would expect too much of their mentors and possibly become frustrated? They would need to go into the experience with very clear expectations and motives. Like: I want to learn how to be more organized, I want to learn how to promote on social media, I want to get better at layouts, I want to write better scripts, so that their mentor would know what to focus on during the limited time they'd be interacting (a few hours per week?)

I also don't think it could be randomly assigned, as I'm sure there will be more people interested in being mentored than people with the time to mentor. I would suggest having the list of mentors up and having the people interested in becoming an apprentice write a letter to the mentor/mentors they'd be interested in learning from and then letting the mentor pick who they think they could help the most. People will learn most effectively from people they want to learn from... and the more experienced artists know their own strengths so they could choose who they could mentor most effectively.

I also do think there should be some incentive for the mentor. In traditional mentoring, the apprentice usually works for the mentor for a reduced rate or free (or even pay the mentor in some cases like tattoo artists and in salons, but that's a bit much). I don't think it would be out of line to have the apprentice do flat colors or something for the mentor since the mentor is going to be putting their time into the relationship.

EDIT: if this is tl/dr, just read what Sarrowsmith posted above, lol

sarrowsmith10 2017-09-27 17:03:38 UTC #8

we are totally on the same wavelength haha. I dig the idea of someone doing flats for the comic. That would save so much time! (my comic, the writer does the flats, but for other people this might be great)

Of course that brings me to another thought- some comic creators already work in teams. I'm assuming you would be apprenticing to a specific person in a team, right? 'Cus I could mentor someone, but I know the writer doesn't have time for that sort of thing.

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 17:07:32 UTC #9

yeah, thats definitely something that would need to be in place.

thats why i specified 'willing' - im aware that it has the potential to be a lot of work, and it should absolutely be an opt in system on both sides. im not sure what incentives you could provide for the mentors... if it were to move on to a collaboration stage, tapas could offer promotion and highlights, and maybe, like @Kayke described from her own experience, mentees acting as assistants?

absolutely. there should be a regulation on who mentors and who gets mentoring. your time limit idea is a really good one, too!

now thats a good idea!

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 17:20:32 UTC #10

that makes sense, yeah, i dont think it would be fair to expect an entire team to mentor an individual creator

UbePie 2017-09-27 17:29:42 UTC #11

I currently have an unpaid internship and i had to sunmit my resume and do an interview. So doing somthing like that would let mentors pick who they want to work with. During the " interview" the apprentice can state what they would like to work on and what are their strengths.

I see no problems with it but people should also be willing to do work in return. You can't expect the mentor to do everything. You have to do research and read and look up stuff, in the end the mentor can only tell you what they did to succeed and help you that way. But their path to success might not work for you, so you also have to work at it.

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 17:32:35 UTC #12

this seems to be a general consensus that im all for, and i like idea people are leaning towards of a system like this being more like an internship, that would be really cool!

i didnt think much of mentor incentive at first because i was thinking of a mentor as a largely hands-off role, just someone who made it who can have a smaller creator's back. however, i think the setups people are describing are way more interesting than that.

IdiotWithPencil 2017-09-27 17:38:14 UTC #13

I would love this =D my biggest problem is that I have no feedback/editor I would love a seasoned veteran to show me the ropes and help me learn how to make a better comic

DiegoPalacios 2017-09-27 18:22:46 UTC #14

I like the idea. It`s great for people learning about drawing and/or writing.
Some important details in my opinion may help to make it better:

1-Mentoring according to genre. For example, if someone is making a science fiction comic, he may be interested in a mentor who knows about alien anatomy or science fiction tropes and story conventions.

2-Choosing the focus on the mentoring: Some are great artists, but struggle with writing, others are the opposite case and some people want to improve in both aspects. The idea would be to get a mentor better fitted to help the student in what he/she needs to improve.

UbePie 2017-09-27 18:38:43 UTC #15

I also think that the recent Incubator program was suppose to be a little bit like this, and I'm sure there will be people who didn't get accepted (once they announce stuff) that still want some mentor-ship.

I do think it's important to stick with genre and specific help. A Romance creator won't be very helpful to a newbie that writes Horror.

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 18:47:42 UTC #16

yeah, the incubator was a really cool lean towards this kind of thing, which is exciting!

and absolutely, people would have to be paired with someone to whom their advice is useful.

IdiotWithPencil 2017-09-27 18:55:14 UTC #17

you know instead of mentors why not editors program =/ editors are actually trained to help artist put out the best quality content possible, I know that the word editor sends shivers down some peoples spine but all of the greatest fiction in the world has had a writer and and editor so why not?

not saying that the mentor programm isn't and excellent idea just asking why not?

Kayke 2017-09-27 19:03:51 UTC #18

I feel like most editors would want to get paid for their work. The only free editor I've ever had is my partner, who helps me because they love me or whatever. I think tapas (or whoever tried to organize that) might have a hard time finding enough editors willing to participate for free.

And while an artist-mentor could have their apprentice do busy-work that they'd learn from, I don't know if the editor would have any tasks a fledgling cartoonist could help them with in exchange?

That being said though, if you're personally looking for editing help: https://forums.tapas.io/t/will-tutor-and-edit-for-fanart/20155

Aspie_Gamer 2017-09-27 19:06:34 UTC #19

Nah...To me, a mentorship program would be a waste of time for those who don't feel like there is anything that they could be taught by a "successful" creator that they couldn't learn on their own or already know from somewhere else. Not to mention the biggest problem I can see with this proposed program is that some of the big time creators would (even if they don't intend for it) subconsciously project what they want onto the small time creator or what they think the site or the readers want rather than nurture what the small time creator wants out of their comic.

Like the old saying goes "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime!". Self sufficiency and being your own biggest critic is the quickest way imo that one will improve upon their craft rather than always asking "does this look right?" or taking advice from people who just plain don't get your vision for your work.

As such, for anybody who thinks they need a mentor, I urge you to read these bullet points below and then really think it over on whether you would actually benefit from having one or not.

Use a search engine to find the necessary materials, tutorials and/or research for your comic. For example, if you want pose refs/sheets, look some up on DeviantArt or go to a pose practice site where you are given maybe a minute per pose to sketch them as quickly as you can.
You aren't going to be good until you actually sit down and do the work. No amount of "practice" will prepare you for this. Just by drawing your comic all the time, you'll quickly get better and can more accurately determine the flaws in your work when you compare your old stuff to what you are currently drawing. Same with writing. Take into account any characters who are getting too much or too little attention. What are your best strengths in your story? What's your weakest link and how can you fix it? Be your own critic and you'll be good to go.
Reach out to comics on your skill level. Be genuine in your comments about their work. If you want to further the relationship, take the initiative and offer guest art/comics. Even just being consistent by putting out the best work that you can do will land you people whom you never thought would be interested in your comic.

UbePie 2017-09-27 19:16:32 UTC #20

While I agree with your statement and am all for self sufficiency, and googleing stuff. I must use your own words against you.

Someone had to teach that man to fish in order for him to feed himself.
That's what a mentor would ideally do. Not hand them stuff but teach them things. A mentor can't teach you to draw they can only give you resources to improve, just as you did above. I have done tons of research, that's what I do. I've joined groups social media, looked up tutorials, and I have improved. But I still have questions that I can't find on the net. There is always information that someone has that can't be found online.

For example in school I have a Portfolio class, we had to write a grant. Could I look up how to write a grant and do it all myself? Yes, I could. Did it benefit me, that I had a professor who has been on the board for that grant, and knows what the board is looking for, look over my grant? Yes. Would I have been able to find that information on the internet? No.

That's what a mentor ship should be.

punkarsenic 2017-09-27 19:18:33 UTC #21

then they can always not apply for the program?

there is a lot you can figure out on your own, and i should know, as thats what ive been doing until recently. but having someone who's been through it all before you there to give feedback and encouragement, if nothing else, is always a nice plus. speaking personally, as a 17 year old and a beginner, i tend to give myself a hard time over different feedback coming from people who aren't that much more experienced than myself - it would be nice to have someone whose opinion i could rely on.