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Mar 2020

@skicoak I see what do you mean.
To show more clearly, why such doubts appear, let me provide an example of the last case, when I doubted, was it JUST humor or not quite. :thinking:


Once I discussed variety of things about society problems with my ex, and the subject of sex workers came up. Among the other things, I noted that prostitutes are very vulnerable part of society, both because they're despised and considered as "less humans" by many people, and because their work is illegal (in our country). I told, that when a prostitute comes to the home of a client, she has increased chance to be robbed, beaten or raped.
The guy told in response: "What do you mean by "rape" a prostitute? To fuck her and not give her money after it? :smile: "
I had doubts, is it joke or not, because, as I already noted, dehumanizing sex workers is common. So I just looked at guy, trying to understand if he's serious or not.
He asked: "What now? Why are you looking at me, like I told something stupid?"
I told: "Because you really told something stupid".
After uneasy pause, I started to explain him the difference between sex for money and rape.
He told: "Yes, yes, I see. I was just joking, don't take it too serious".


If he would talk that it was a joke immediately, when he saw my reaction, I would not even remember this case. But these pauses made things look less than a joke and more like he told something between joke and what he really thinks and waited for my reaction, to turn it into more joke or less joke accordingly to it.
Of course, it's more than possible that all what I wrote is overthinking, I took his reactions too seriously and annoyed him by explaining him things he already understands well. :nerd: But if I have a suspicious, I think I'll better explain just in case... I don't think it caused him (or any other people in similar situations) any problems, except that they'll think that I'm tedious and take some topics too serious.
But I think I have a right to overthink this topic sometimes, considering my background :stuck_out_tongue:

Uggh.
Surely, cases of female harassment also worth to be taken seriously. It's annoying to hear that people mocked on you, when you felt so bad, instead of trying to understand you and to do anything about that girl. I don't talk on topic of harassment, made by females, just because I personally don't know much about this topic and didn't face it in my life. NOT because I find it unimportant or something.

ok whoever said this really needs to get their head cracked. Men are phisically intimidated constantly in highschool, the scrawny kid who gets picked on by the jock, or with teachers.

hell there is a video of a female teacher picking up a small kid by the neck and chastising him.

also here's a shocker about half of rape cases are men victims, wanna know why?
prison rape, yeah men get raped just as much as women, the diffrence is society dosen't accept it and dismises it cause men are stronger than women.

like you are doing right now actually

sounds like he was making a joke and it fell flat, it happens from time to time, I think you are looking to much into it or you thought it was in bad taste which is ok, though saying he doesn't empathise with rape victims is kind of reaching.

to me at least

Haha. Of course, I'm not going to go and tell "rapist, don't rape!" to the criminals. :grin: I'm more than aware that people, who do sex-related things by force, understand only a language of force by themselves. What I'm trying to do is to talk with normal guys, who have lack of understanding on this topic (see the update of the main post :joy: ).

That's why I want to make them care in a bit more degree.

that's literally misandry, what the heck?

look if women are living in fear 24/7 cause a guy might rape them then that says more about the woman who equates all males are rapists

look rape is horrible but let's not turn the coin like this and blame it all on men, and fear monger like this, it's not helpful and the only thing your gonna achieve is to disenfranchise 50% of the world population for what 1% does

@33rdCenturyCaveman @IdiotWithPencil Rate between men's and women's chances to be an object of violence are all relative and depends on particular men and women and particular society.
It's just... particular guys around me never were in jail or in any other places, where they could experience a "joys" of being harassed or raped. I can't tell about the whole society.

Sorry, didn't understand what did you mean here.

Me not blaming all men. But when women disguise themselves as men, one thing they notice is how much more personal space they get as men, even very effeminate ones.

well I can affirm that here in Mexico it's worst like hella worst than in Venezuela XD

Venezuela rapist would go to court with black eyes and broken bones cause the police would break them and the prisoner would destroy them.

we hate rapist like crazy, and we as a culture disown any rapist, though we will make rape jokes and laught at the victims if we find it funny. we will laugh whill buying a bat to break the legs of the rapist

sorry maybe I can't write that well so I use the grammer check, Empathetic is the word I was trying to use it came out wrong

I just mean him not relating to actual victims is a stretch, like I can't relate with being rape cause i haven't been raped is crazy cause humans have Empathy, unless you are a psyco or sociopath everybody can relate to one situation or another

maybe his way of relating isin't the same way you relate. His way could be by making jokes while yours is by taking it seriously

we are all flawd in some way and our coping mechanism are diverse

Somebody telling me that I'm not allowed to joke about something immediately makes me want to joke about it. It may offend some people, but the idea that I should be censored to appease someone else offends ME; so we arrive at a moral stale mate.

Whose offense takes precedent?

It's not your place to explain topeople the evils of no-no jokes. Tell them you don't find it funny, but unless they invite further discussion you aren't going to 'enlighten' anyone by lecturing them.

Me am reminded of how famous insult comic Don Rickles was able to get away with it: by being completely genuine, radiating good will, and ragging on absolutely everybody.

It sounds like some of what you're talking about has happened in the work place. I just have to say that there are some things that while may be okay around other groups of people, are 100% not okay in the work place. Unless it's relevant to something at work, why bring up rape at all? Just don't bring it up or even sex in general. These are serious issues and anybody could take something as sexual harassment which can have consequences. Another is putting hands on people for any reason. Just. Don't. Do It. It's really about workplace safety for everyone.

the problem with that is that you are basically telling humans to be machined, look in the workplace is just like a highschool just with adults, and it stands to reason that some co-workers will feel more comfortable with other coworkers and start saying jokes they would normally not say(I know women do this too cause my sister makes jokes about her coworkers smell and attitudes constantly to another female co worker, even making fun of the marriage of one of them no really nice stuff but hey it's funny), they might offend another coworker by accident, but should that coworker be chastised for it? I don't think so

also sometimes one co-worker might want to go out with another one, it is normal when two people share a lot of time and space together that they might want to try something, now if they are persistent after being rejected or are using their position to convince you then yeah, get the hell out of there or complain to the high heavens.
just don't do it cause they touch you in a nonsexual way or said a stupid joke, that's not helpful and actually thanks to that right now women in the workplace are being negatively affected.

To clarify, I'm not making any distinction between gender and it's not okay for anyone (I'm someone who has witnessed much more woman -> man harassment than man -> woman). I'm also not the person making these rules, I just try to obey them. Sexual harassment can be strict given the outrage of cancel culture and the like. I think it's better to err on the side of caution, unless you don't care about your job and like to live life on the edge.

I've known people in relationships who work together and from my experience it hasn't caused issues but it can also be considered sexual harassment. One of my past jobs was clear that you could not have a relationship with someone on the same team and especially not with someone in a superior position (since that could be seen as special treatment).

I also wouldn't really compare high school with work life since high school is a time when people start finding relationships and classmates are close with each other. It's not the same when you're getting paid to do work. Not to mention, you're supposed to be a responsible adult at this point so I would say there is more responsibility to not being seen as a creep and making an uncomfortable environment for others.

I also wouldn't say that this is saying that people need to be machined. I disagree with that completely. But there are rules. When your actions actually affect other people, that does matter. I'm all about having fun at work and I've had some really great times talking about podcasts, playing VR games, having office parties, playing with puppies, etc. There is a difference between good fun and potentially harmful or discomforting actions.

There is a line between censorship and freedom of speech and to be clear I am completely anti-censorship of any sort. But freedom of speech doesn't protect you against inciting violence against other people.

And, um, if you are in a relationship with someone at work... please don't try and do "stuff" at work. :upside_down: ffs, just do work. lol

yeah, that's what I'm against and what is ultimately hurting women in the workplace these days. Managers are now on edge with women cause of cancel culture and are doing some very bad things just to avoid it, not coaching new hires, meetings can not be one on one(even if it's personal work related performance) and they will not be in a room alone with a women without a camera or another person. it's getting crazy right now.

there is a law against inciting violence on other people(like death threats and the like can and have gotten people in trouble), and there is also laws against enacting violence on other

yep agreed 100% do that at home or any other place, please

I guess we can agree on that I also say you should follow rules, but there should be some flexibility on both sides I think