INK Concerns (with MATH!)

[jensrichard77]

You are right! You are right about everything you say.
But all this we know.
And all this is also told by Tapas.

What we do not know and what we have been tested with new profiles is a loss of 33% that are not told about anywhere.

Buying 1600 ink for 1.99$ gives you a value of 1.33$ (-33%) before all the fees that you speak off.

Buying 1600 ink from Appstore cost me ~2.60$ the local tax ~23% are included at the Appstore
After that, I still get the same value as from the webshop at 1.99$ but the value shows up as 1.33$ (-33%)
Then all the fees spoke off will be taken.

The last test was 1600 ad ink only.
That shows up as the same value at 1.33$ before alL fees.

It is that hidden fee of 33% we are asking about.
And why any kind of ink shows up as same value at 1.33%

[colinmooredraws]

Please go back and look at my actual screenshots and equations. As well as that of Jens.

If one is in a region where additional fees are charged, they are added at the purchase phase.

Credit card fees are not 33%. And credit card processing fees would be covered by the “transaction fee” taken on top of Tapas’ cut.

We are not talking about free or ad revenue ink. Just what is directly purchased.

I have addressed every single theory already. Please stop making assumptions. If it were any of this, Michaelson would have said as much. I am seeking transparency over missing funds and dismissive statements such as these do not help.

We have a promise from a staff member for answers. If you think the system is fine as-is, you are welcome to mute this thread and move on.

[hannahlaine]

My brain hurts now lol

[Larslaustsen]

I can not see why @michaelson has his priority on unlocking buttons when this 33% (@jensrichard77 @colinmooredraws write about) will rune the inkgivings for me and others. People are already taking the inksgoal down and it is not only me, I have seen a lot of them around. The internet is fast and if you have a business on the internet you have to be fast too. (I know this on my own body)
If I do not know where my money goes to, I will not buy more ink then I have promised some others in this forum. And as @colinmooredraws write, the word of this will goes more around tomorrow.
So please @michaelson or @others_from_tapas tell us what is happening.

[Kelheor]

I can not see why @michaelson has his priority on unlocking buttons

Mostly because there are thousands of people (probably like 95%) who don't know about forum, this ink problem and this thread in particular, so they will give out the ink anyway. How many people read this thread, maybe a hundred? So yeah, other thousands are the priority for Tapas.

[Larslaustsen]

Ya maybe this time but what about next time.
If I want to support one with 1$ or 1200 ink and I know the one will get more money from my from Ko-fi or others payment than ink. I will support from ko-fi. That is bad business, I will do the whole here on Tapas

[jensrichard77]

If I want to support one with 1$ or 1200 ink and I know the one will get more money from my from Ko-fi

they always will get more with Ko-Fi.
Tapas need to take there cut for running this service.
AND THAT'S FAIR

But they are taking way too much

[TAMAnnoying]

I think the reason people are on edge about not getting an answer now rather then later is for the simple fact that inlsgiving is here and, for someone like me, I actually pay for my ink to give to creators in hopes of getting more bang for my buck and give them MORE later. If it turns out this is just a problem and we’re not loosing 50% of our money to give to other creators then cool, if it turns out we’re loosing 50% because of mystery reasons then whatever but that means I as both a creator and a supporter would like to make sure people are informed of what they’re loosing out with ink instead of say Kofi, even during inks giving. And some people DO buy ink for inksgiving so it’s only far that readers are aware of this

[Larslaustsen]

@jensrichard77 okay I will like to pay a extra 15% more to Tapas for the service. But still I will like to know if the extra 33% also goes to Tapas or someone else.

[machimaquiaveli]

a lot from Euro can not do this

I have vibrant pretty news for you

[colinmooredraws]

And some people DO buy ink for inksgiving so it’s only far that readers are aware of this

This is exactly it. It's important now because of Inksgiving. And you are correct. It's not that the extra 33% is vanishing, it's that they're not being up front about it.

If there's a tax or fee or something, tell us. But also, if it is a fee, then what's the 15% transaction fee on web transaction even for?

Anywhere else, exact fees are accounted for in detailed, legal documentation that users can look up. When you get a credit card, or a bank account, or paypal, you have a document that details all the complicated fees that are involved. You don't have a choice when your credit card charges you 26% compound interest, but you know what you'll be charged before you even sign up.

Even if they don't change it, it still needs to be documented and stated in clear terms what is happening.

Accountability and transparency in financial transactions. That is all I am asking for.

[burginlewis]

I'm most concerned about how this will affect growth, if true. Will authors choose not to publish here because they think Tapas is being shady? Will readers choose not to ink creators because they believe it will be swiped?

[joannekwan]

Will authors choose not to publish here because they think Tapas is being shady?

This is always my concern. I wish Tapas was big enough to hire a public/creator liaison to handle these things instead putting such a heavy load on Michael who's already tasked with a million other things.

[colinmooredraws]

Will authors choose not to publish here because they think Tapas is being shady?

It's certainly influenced my decisions on where to host my comic. Right now Tapas is my primary place to publish, and where I point my domain. But now I'm working on moving it completely off the site and taking it somewhere else.

[rajillustration]

So uh...this question is still unanswered huh?

[jensrichard77]

I know?
What to do??

[colinmooredraws]

So uh...this question is still unanswered huh?

Yuuuup. Not even a "still looking into it."

[jensrichard77]

What we do not know and what we have been tested with new profiles is a loss of 33% that are not told about anywhere.

Buying 1600 ink for 1.99$ gives you a value of 1.33$ (-33%) before all the fees that you speak off.

Buying 1600 ink from Appstore cost me ~2.60$ the local tax ~23% are included at the AppstoreAfter that, I still get the same value as from the webshop at 1.99$ but the value shows up as 1.33$ (-33%)Then all the fees spoke off will be taken.

The last test was 1600 ad ink only.That shows up as the same value at 1.33$ before alL fees.

It is that hidden fee of 33% we are asking about.And why any kind of ink shows up as same value at 1.33%

Asking someone smart here.
@tired_programmer welcome back to the forum. My post here is the result of what you have being missing.
What do you think about it?
-not the long debate with strong words. But the result. That there is a proven fact that there is a 33% hidden extra fee that nobody knows of? And Tapas can’t or won't answer for?

You are the smartest person I know in the forum.
What do you think we should do?

Se this also https://forums.tapas.io/t/ink-concerns-with-math/38519/123

[unknown_user]

I didn't read the whole topic, because it's so big, but only the last message. So I'm sorry from advance, if, by the chance, I missed something important or repeat something already said.

But I think that your problem is, that you take the value of ink, bought at the worst offer (i.e. in amount of 1600), as the base value. I.e. that you think that the base value of 1 ink is 1.99/1600 = 0,00124375 $, since you buy 1600 ink for 1.99$.
But for me it looks that "the base value of ink" is the value, which we get from the best offer: 40000 + 20000 for 49.99$. I.e., I'd say, that the base value of 1 ink is 49.99/60000 =~ 0.00083167$. In this case, the "base" value of 1600 Ink would really be very close to 1.33$, as it seems for you as for creator.

So I think, that the "hidden fee" arise from the "fine", which we have when we buy small amount of ink.

[vothnthorvaldson]

That would make sense.
Now, what looks ethically wrong to me is that the way it is advertised make it sound like the base value is the small amounts, and that if you buy big amounts you get a rebate. When actually, buying big amounts would give you the base price, and small amounts would give you a penalty. Now that's such a common strategy that I'm not sure people see that as unethical anymore, but I do. It's misleading on purpose, at minima.