Meaty Reviews Season 1 (Post your Comic, Get a Meaty Review) (Finished)

[GalacticPotato]

Thanks, and don't be afraid to tear it apart of you feel like it's fair! >:3

[ScribbleJay]

@GusCammisa
Thank you so much for the meaty review. Honestly, I had no idea going in what you'd say, but you seemed to enjoy Sideways a lot more than I expected. I'm pretty hard on myself, so the encouragement helped me a lot. I still feel like there's a lot of room for improvement, but I feel more confident now that I'm heading in the right direction.
As for the critters, don't worry! I'm deliberately going to be making them weirder and weirder as the story progresses.
Thanks again! These in-depth reviews are awesome.

[GusC]

Round 15

Trip Across the Multiverse

Goals:
The sense of ease you have about your expectations will serve you well. The pressure cooker that is our brain can turn against us--I saw each of your hiatus notices, and was pleased to see that you did in fact press on each time. I can think of a few people I've seen who have been so disappointed in themselves or so bitter about circumstance that they gave up on their passion project. Out of shame, of all things! Your flexible realism should help you endure the many trials of putting your creative work out there for everyone (or no one) to see. it should also help you receive the slings and arrows of outrageous criticisms that I may have.

But while it is important that you maintain your obvious sense of stability and peace of mind, I would hope that you are not allowing that to shift into nonchalance and laziness. That is probably the most prolific murderer of ambition and creation. So far so good, right?

Art:
You shouldn't have to worry about the furry angle. You've maintained innocence in design. Also, bear in mind as you read this section that I ultimately think your art is sufficient. Now that that's out of the way, I want to give some modest praise for the leap of quality you've made since you began your journey. You've improved in every aspect--the line-work is more confident and lively, the expressions (which were good from the get go) are even more compelling, and your anatomy has sharpened and refined itself. Gone are most of the clumsy looking hands and the erratic proportions.

I have to say, though, I'm disappointed that you abandoned the original style. The more bestial faces, mostly meaning the more cat like mouths and eyes, are far more compelling and cool looking than the derivative Zootopia mimic you have going here. This is definitely a personal taste, but I find animal media far more interesting the closer it gets to the animal side of things--visually and all. The balance you have now is safer but pretty boring. That is by far my most important issue with the art. It is competent, but it is whitebread. I don't see any risks being taken or any big dramatic panels being attempted. Safe is safe, it is never great.

Check out Pages 48-53. This is a good example. There is nothing inherently wrong with anything here other than the total lack of energy. Big onomatopoeia and action lines do not an exciting confrontation scene make. I feel no rush of adrenaline or tension here. The poses aren't stiff, but they're basic. The angles and perspectives aren't oblong or flawed, but they are definitely uninspiring. I'm fairly certain this is all wrapped up in the unique brand of comic dynamics: presentation. Your art is good enough to do the job, but the character design and the presentation of the page encourages no circuit of energy between the reader and the page. Is the comic fun? Yes, you've accomplished that goal. Is it exciting? Absolutely not.

A few more words on character design, as this is the only other possible problem that deserves nuance--you have slick characters who are mostly distinct (which may be owed mostly to color differences) but they are very bland. Cats in clothes is all they are. Nothing about Vance's appearance suggests anything about his personality or character arc other than Ranger training induced fitness. His image relies on the contrast of his green eyes and his black fur to make him look badass and dangerous. There's nothing else going on there. The same applies to Trip, who is probably the most disappointing example of the change of style. He looks great in the first few pages, but he's quickly lost himself in his archetype. We'll talk about that in a bit. Hound is maybe the worst offender here. What a boring looking antagonist he is. he really is just a clean looking Fox in a jumpsuit.

For me, this is where animal stories should be most compelling--there are so many CRAZY creatures out there of all kinds, with fantastically compelling physiology and cultural symbology attached to them. I can only wonder, then, why your characters seem so vanilla. I can't say for certain. I suspect it may have something to do with either your comparatively blase expectations or a slight lack of confidence. Or is it the conventions of the genre? This is something to think about, because this screams opportunity, especially given how many characters you've already introduced.

Writing:
Once again, it is sufficient. I'm mostly concerned with why it isn't great, which it certainly could be. It's the same problem as the art--it's pretty boring. it is fun, it is amusing, and it is pleasing to the eye, but I am not excited about the comic, nor am I waiting with baited breath for the resolution of the conflict. Part of this is pacing--this comic moves erratically, and even more strangely, happens to be slowest during the least interesting parts.

The strong start--Mr. Hunt getting gunned down--is resolved harmlessly a few pages later. The dramatic entrance of Hound is almost immediately dealt with--off screen, no less. Each time the comic presents me with an intriguing and exciting possibility, the story leaps forward. Another example--the green eyed watcher in the woods. We cut away from it shadowing Trip and Vance and are back in the safety of daytime. It's very strange. Conversely, we have spent quite a few pages following the dull investigations of Hunt and Carmen and the already numerous asymmetrical conversations between Trip and Vance. This is by far the biggest problem of the writing. The story has some compelling moments that are almost immediately rushed along. I keep thinking of more examples--the fight between Vance and Hershel ends IMMEDIATELY. It's a disservice to your efforts.

The dialogue ranges from passable to downright amusing.I don't find it contributing much--and frankly, the constant "dude"s from Trip have become excessive and frustrating. Hound is awkward, Hunt is hit or miss in his grizzled middle aged grit, and the rest don't have much to say. At least not yet.

Summation:
It's a competent comic, no doubt about it. Rereading my review, it may seem very negative, but my primary point is that you have tools that you aren't using. This has great potential, but it is hamstrung by something I can't determine myself. I leave it to you to examine whether you are putting real effort into this. It is equally rushed and torpid. It seems to rely on the simplest of genre conventions while avoiding the most compelling. It's early in the story, and I'm sure there is a long way to go. Your vision will be realized in time, i'm sure, but I hope you dare to have one or two pretensions. They might do wonders.

[GusC]

Aha! Last but certainly not least. I am reading it now. I will try to finish my review tonight. I am not bothered by any possible disclaimers you might have. I learned, in embarrassing ways, that I am hopelessly desensitized.

That said, I am eager to see your take on the oft covered but rarely respected themes of mental trauma. I personally find stories involving PTSD to be largely unfulfilling, despite it being one of my favorite tropes. Trauma is tricky to explore tastefully.

[UrMom]

Awesome! Good luck! From what I've seen of your comic I figured you would be fine with the contents of mine, I just like putting it up to be safe. Don't want to scar any pure souls.

Thank you so much for your time!

[GusC]

I read through it but I am bushed--tomorrow.

[GalacticPotato]

To be entirely honest, I do think I aimed a little low with this one, mostly due to fear of it eventually becoming too much for a start on the whole comic making process, and in some way, to get comfortable with the huge project I'd be working on from then on.
I had some big pretentions from the very beginning, but I wanted to keep the introduction kind of sweet and simple, but that may have been a bad decision overall since it might even act as an entry barrier.

I've been trying, especially since around page 45 to be a little more ambitious with art, to do some more interesting shots and poses, I'm going especially after studying expressive poses an gesture but I guess I'm not really succeeding so far. It's good to know though, I need to try on that even harder.

About character design, I will say I've thought they were overly simple for a while now, and I've been trying to fix that behind the scenes too, mainly by changing the details on what they wear because at this point, I really don't know if it would be right to have another general character redesign, maybe going a bit further on the animal thing would be better, but maybe it's too late now, I need to ask my readers later.

About writing I'll say, I'm not the kind of guy who likes "handholdy" writing, that's why a lot of characters don't have their names and roles spelled out or exposed when it wouldn't make sense, why not a lot is explained, I like a story to introduce questions and rather than giving you an answer, naturally let you put everything together. I think the biggest example of this is the silhouette on the encounter with the green eyes creature, which matches Hershel's general shape, now is that really him? But sadly, it seems to have flown over most people's heads.
Other than that, I completely agree XD I'm not really a writer, and I have next to no past experience with it, so I'll just have to develop that skill overtime like I did drawing.

Overall this is one of the most negative opinions I've heard about my comic XD but that's good, and really refreshingly honest because it feels like something people should've told me much earlier, and more than that, a good indication of where to steer the comic on the coming pages and the next chapter (which I'm trying my best to be more cohesive and exciting)

Now am I putting real effort into it? For sure. I spend every last bit of my free time working on it
Am I giving it my all? Sadly, no. I still need to go to school and keep my grades up, study both art and regular school subjects and keep my reputation of honor student, that free time I mentioned ends up being really reduced, bit really, that's just an excuse.

Thanks for your amazing review, and keep these up!

[Azifri]

Now I'm regretting not entering my comic when I first found this post and it had no replies! I know you'd shred me, but your reviews are so detailed and to the point. If you do more reviews, could you add me to the list? <3

[therippleeffectcomic]

My writing partner is working on book 2 at the moment. We have a very strong idea on how it ends (can't wait to get to that), but there's a lot of wiggle room in terms of getting from A to Z, which is fun.

[Rodimus13]

It looks like you are almost done with your list. You know when you will take more?

[GusC]

I'm going to critique The Guide to a Healthy Relationship and be done with the first wave. Then, I'm going to take the next few days to get my own two pages a week done for my comic.

And then, probably around Tuesday, I'll call for the second wave.

[GusC]

As I said, I wouldn't take this as a negative review. Your comic has few real issues. The big problem is simply it's lack of ambition, which can be fixed with time.

[GusC]

Around Tuesday, I expect to open entries back up. I'll keep a look out for you.

[GusC]

Round 16

The Guise to a Healthy Relationship

Goals:
Your focus on mental illness and its themes was obviously the most striking. No other comic posted had such a decisively motivated focus on a theme--and it certainly shows in the comic. I wonder if you consider this comic as some kind of creative activism. Actually, activism might be a misleading word--I think I mean that I wonder if you approach your comic with the same mindset as one would have in supporting some cause. Is this a creative exploration or a disciplined message? Someone on these forums actually had a good phrase--would you consider this a moral argument, or is it not so aggressive?

Your comic definitely exudes a unique feeling of purpose. This may be due to the sheer weight of misery and depravity that chokes the entire experience, but I can't help but think that it may be your own conviction and empathy being channeled through this outlet. It certainly feels personal.

Art:
The possible issues I have are in no way connected to technique or skill. You clearly have both in spades. It's all the more impressive given the traditional medium you've chosen. I'm glad to see you've stood by the method, because it gives your comic a unique--and strangely eerie--character. It also has the indirect effect of creating a channel of sympathy and awe between me, the reader, and you, the author. The level of work that must go into every page has a palpable effect on how I judge the work. Some could argue that's cheating, but I think the technical skill of artwork is in and of itself a quantifiable value.

So you're nailing the art concepts, that's been established. It looks professional and polished. All that good stuff. The issue--or maybe this is the triumph--is just how grotesque the visuals (ALL of the visuals) are. I love that, it's my jam, but I wonder about the implications. Every character physically manifests their degenerate vices and depraved hedonistic lifestyles. Even sympathetic characters like Julian--his chain smoking, his malcontent, his maladjustment, his misanthropy, it all oozes through his filthy hair, his rat-like face, and his chaffed, messed up hands. Now this is effective, much like it is in Flirting with Death, but given your intentions, I have to question whether there is a point at which the ugliness and hedonic excess of the characters begins to become sadistic.

Writing:
I'm a fan of going deep into the grim nature of it all, but the mentally ill or stunted characters have begun to lose sympathy. The result is that i found myself rooting for a grand stroke of comeuppance against half the cast. Galia and the landlady are the only one's who I feel deserve to be happy and successful, The rest seem so boorish that it's hard to connect with them, and I was impatient for a real reckoning by the end.

That said, I want to congratulate you on your commitment--not in that you've been maintaining this for almost three years, but that you've stuck with the darkness for so long. There was no shift in tone or mood; it remained desperate, bleary eyed, hopeless for the entire ride. Considering the themes of mental illness, the story is clear and concise--and most importantly, devoid of any distracting subplots. There is only the slow excavation of guilt and shame. It's moving, in a twisted way.

I don't know your intentions, but Daniel creeps me out. It's funny, because he's the only character who has his life together by the looks of things. I should betreating him like a shelter from the storm of excess, but there's something about him that unnerves me. Perhaps it is how dramatically he does stand out from every other character. He's the only one who looks put together, and doesn't look like he's being consumed by his sins. Apollo has a similar problem in that as much as I want to root for him as the MC, he's insufferable. Yes, this is intentional, as he is the emotionally stunted manchild, but in keeping with my primary concern, at what point am I meant to be rooting for him--or for anyone? When does the depravity and self obsession end?

Summation:
It's a striking story, no question. The art is wonderfully made, and makes every second of effort manifest. In a way, you, the creator, have become the MC for me in this experience. I found myself rooting for you ever page, thinking "Holy hell, he's maintaining quality and keeping up the method!" Much like with Sideways, I am in no position to judge the art. it is beyond my ability. My only concern is that prospective readers who aren't charmed by the superficially cute characters like Apollo will find themselves lost in the pit of filth you've created with your cast. Navigating the repugnant personalities and hedonistic lifestyles is a demanding trial.

If your primary goal is to frame mental illness in a respectful, serious way--then i cannot say for certain if you have succeeded or not. The manifestation of Julian's warped mind is straightforward and at times melodramatic. Any time a character screams at the voices in his head is a moment I feel myself pulled out of the moment. The little I know about such things makes me think it should be more insidious, more cruel. The manifestations of trauma come through wonderfully in your art, but in the writing it seems too on the nose. There must be a more subtle, artful, and moving way to convey the damage that is so central to the story and its characters.

[GusC]

And with that, we're done for a few days. I want to thank and congratulate those folks who submitted their work--God knows that there are few ways to make yourself so vulnerable on the internet. I am inspired by everyone's work, regardless of whether I personally enjoyed it or not, because every single comic was so clearly made with love and care. You should all be even more motivated to excel and advance in your hobby or career. I urge you to pay it forward--there are so many people out there desperate for someone--anyone--to acknowledge their hard work. As a community, we should be more focused on trying to help each other grow by giving Meaty Critiques to our peers.

[UrMom]

Thank you so much for the feedback, Gus!

Ahead of time, so sorry for the text wall! I babble a lot. None of it is bad, I swear!

Is this a creative exploration or a disciplined message? Someone on these forums actually had a good phrase--would you consider this a moral argument, or is it not so aggressive?

Creative exploration may be the correct term? A month or so ago I answered a question in a Q&A asking about inspiration, this was the answer. Sorry about how awkwardly broken up it is in the link, I'm not going to post the thing here because it's too long. To sum the answer up, my comic was/is made for venting years of toxic emotions that were build up from awful experiences I've had. You hit the nail on the head that TGtaHR is very personal. As awful as it sounds I don't even care what people get out of it emotionally, they could hate it, they could love it, the comic can make them feel depressed. All that matters to me is that they understand that 'X' character is experiencing 'B', and they feel 'H'. If readers unanimously get that, and if they feel something, I'm doing my job.

Everything you say kinda makes me happy, I feel so bad. Making readers uncomfortable through sadistically, ugly details was something I wanted to do. As well as make awful, unlikable characters... Well, I can't say I intentionally did the latter, there were actually no intentions of making them likable or not when stitching together their personalities. Although I did want to make them all sensationally flawed. The feedback I receive are fragment of a personal social experiment, it's fun, and helpful for me to see how readers perceive certain personality types given the situation. It's really interesting to see who they're rooting for, if any, and why. Some people really love Apollo and Julian, some find Julian to be mean while Apollo is the victim, all their reasons are so unique and interesting! If anything I want the comic to be an experience, something to draw out some kind of emotions. Sorry if none of this makes sense.

For Julian, I dreadfully knew they would come across as almost ridiculously melodramatic to some since I'm one of those people. The prologue to me was such cheesy trash. Like you I'm totally desensitized to all things grotesque and horrific, not sure if we're similar because most of mine comes from emotional deadening. I can't feel a whole lot, even when faced with real life horrors. BUT. I DIGRESS. I'm not sure if this is lack of skill making Julian come off like that? Personally I don't have any experience with their mental problems outside of depression, anxiety, and paranoia. All of my knowledge comes from research, private conversations with people who've had those illnesses, videos, etc. Even if I did know, it may not change anything because how different our viewpoints are as a species, some readers may still find Julian a character they can't take seriously.
"Would it change anything if I had experience with this?" Is something that comes to mind a lot with this comic.

Again, thank you very much! I'll definitely take what you say to heart, and apply it to how I portray things in the future. I will say, some of these characters will get what's coming to them in the end... in a way. TGtaHR is intended to be 11 chapters long. If anything, at least Apollo learn something in the end since he's the MC. I can't say if the depictions of mental illness will be respectful or tasteful as I hope it would be, but I want to try making it at least somewhat empathetic. If anything, can't say I didn't try, right? It's all a learning experience.

[Kittosaurus]

@GusCammisa Here is my attempt to return the favor with a meaty review for you:

The Art:

You seem to have a proficient grasp on anatomy. You do have a janky hand or limb here are there but for the most part it doesn't bother or distract me too much. Except for those teeth! (They may be even more terrifying than mine! Though more fitting to your style) The backgrounds and detailing of the costumes is where you seem to shine the most. I also like your selective use of color.

Straight away I noticed that you had some messy coloring, particularly the second panel where the grey and his hair and beard hair is out of the lines.This is prevalent in a majority of your panels but on a lesser scale - There is even one panel where one of the characters ear isn't colored in so you can see the background behind coming through. I also noticed in several places that your line work doesn't connect (ie line of the hand doesn't connect to the wrist). This comes off as rushed or inexperienced to me. I feel the use of varying line weight would be very beneficial to you.

Greyscale - while time saving is tricky to balance, and I feel your panels suffer from not having enough contrast. Particularly in scenes involving crowds. If you are up to it, I feel the addition of of hatching or cross-hatching, could not only help emphasize your shadows/ specific details but would also help your artwork evoke that era.

Another nit-pick I have is the speech bubbles they look like they are still part of your rough draft. Take a bit more time to polish these shapes (especially the tales - some of them are almost as thick as the bubble - which makes them look more unbalanced) and again make sure to connect these lines! Little changes like these will make a big impact on the overall look/ professionalism of your comic.

Your comic is not very mobile friendly. The text in the speech bubbles gets waaaay too small once you hit chapter one. Even for computer users I would try and break up the text bubbles more as they get pretty meaty in some scenes! You also have to watch the placement of your speech bubbles - there should be a clear path for the eye to follow when multiple characters are speaking with multiple bubbles

It looks like you started using some 3d elements or possibly started using a perspective grid in around the time you start telling the back story or Jovan as the backgrounds loose the organic feel they had before and feel much more manufactured (this may also be the lack of "background clutter" compared to previous scenes so it is more noticable.

Story:

I'll admit this comic wasn't exactly my cup of tea...

First lets talk about pacing. The prologue was intriguing and just the right length, but, in my opinion Chapter one is way too long! You should break that up into at least 3 sections, possibly more! While long form comics are becoming more acceptable it is going to be a challenge to hold the average readers attention for that long. Admittedly if I wasn't doing a review I probably would've stopped reading about half way through chapter one as I was just plain bored.

While the characters had their own unique designs, I'll admit most of them I forgot their names as soon they were out of the panel, while this may be a symptom of my disinterest, I think this again relates to the pacing issue. You introduce sooo much information, not only in the panels themselves but also in the dialogue, that my brain is simply not taking all of it in. I lost count of the storylines you introduced in this chapter. You should think about splitting each storyline into a separate episode - unless they can tie together more fluidly.

I will admit I did enjoy some of the dialogue. You have a knack for the obscenities. But I think you rely too heavily on the dialogue and should aim to show us more about the characters through their actions and mannerisms.

Summation:

I think you have made a great start. I am not your target audience so I find it hard to provide a critique in that aspect. You clearly have a lot of passion for this, and I can see that you put in a lot of hard work. But you also need to know when to fight your battles. There are a lot of panels, where you could probably do without the elaborate backgrounds or crowds and focus more on polishing the character(s) that the reader is supposed to be focusing on.

Especially with long form you can give your panels more room to breath. Everything is so tightly condensed and I think even spacing it out more will help and allow you to split up the text where needed. As I previously mentioned I also think you should try splitting up Chapter one into more episodes. Again - give your reader some time to breathe!

Hopefully that was enough meat for you! Again I really appreciated your critique!

[GusC]

Wonderful! Many thanks for the look over. I love the meat.

I am both relieved and ashamed that a good chunk of the issues you mentioned have been shown to me sporadically throughout the months I've been working on this. I agree wholeheartedly with all of them, particularly when it comes to line weight--which has bedeviled me since the start--and the text bubbles--which I have tried changing several times throughout with different approaches: Shape tool, hand done, some combination... oof.

I may give up on mobile, which could be stupendously stupid--but it's a whole other dimension that takes up space in my learning mind. I can't help but think i'd be biting off more than I could chew.

The point about splitting chapters--that was something that slowly dawned on me as I read through everyone's work here. What the hell was I doing? People were splitting their stuff up into such digestible chunks. I feel half mad for not changing this. That's my goal for the next update.

I have not used any 3d references, but I have been desperately trying to beef up my own sloppy fundamentals, including perspective. So I can imagine that many backgrounds are too ruler-y and awkwardly geometric. I pray this will improve in time.

I understand that it was probably not up your alley. Frankly, I'm often worried that it is too much a tribute to the friends who made it possible, effectively cutting off anybody else from getting invested. That's probably why I'm often unable to determine what is and is not too much information... the archive of lore in my head blinds me--and the reader!

The dialogue is definitely disproportionately important in my mind. I'm glad the bombastic obscenities--or lack thereof--was amusing. I was certainly trying. Your advice to open up the comic is a change I will inevitably have to make, because I often do feel cramped. i think i chose the 8 by 11.5 inch canvas out of sheer comfort and anxiety--and the intoxicating idea of holding a print of it all in my hands.

I loved this. Thank you again for taking the time to read a work you would otherwise pass over. It is invaluable for confirming my suspicions, focusing my efforts, and revealing new avenues of growth.

That was some fine meat.

[danitasibert]

I see its closed now but i was interested in a review, i understand if you can't get to it, but whenever you have the time.

Maximum Chaos | Tapas

Premise: A newly married couple gets involved with a police officer scheme for revenge, it turns out to be more in depth then just the home country. Along the way they realize things expands all around the world of Aphenia (a fantasy/mythological world)

Genre: Fantasy, Action, Adventure/Comedy

Intentions/expectations: this is my first comic in a long time, so I'm trying to make its feel like a show in comic form. I have an education in media arts and animation, but animation is not really realistic for me at the moment; so i figure to try to work on my work in comic form instead and see where it takes me. (the story so far is still the first arc for the series, its going to expand after what i have now.)

[GusC]

Great to see this! I'm done for the next few days, but you've secured the number 2 spot for next week--probably around Tuesday. I'm looking forward to it.