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May 2019

Why shouldn't you have that capability if you aren't premium? Many creators already give early access to chapters on Patreon, but it would be much easier for readers to get the content directly from Tapas. And besides, it would benefit Tapas as well because readers would be spending and buying more ink.

I like this idea. :stuck_out_tongue: I'd love to give some people chapters or stories early just so the wait isn't that long for them.

its because we, as free to read creators are not really making Tapas money, so we are not at a high priority

it is the truth but watch someone tatle on me to a mod and the mod comes marching in here and talk to me like im fucking 5

I understand that we aren't a super high priority, but it would still be a nice feature to have, in my opinion. Whether or not the Tapas team decides to implement it is a different question entirely.

I don’t mean to say the Tapas team doesn't care, either. I just think trying to listen to the opinions of everyone is a big job, and so there have to be some priorities.

thats the reason they wont do it, because it is a good idea

actually, Tapas already has it (the wait to read feature), but again.,.. only for the PrEmIuM cOmIcS

Well, what would you suggest would be a better idea for a new Tapas feature?

I personally like the idea of expanding this feature away from just Premium Comics and give others a chance to do so. Course, I can see the possible backlash with some readers, but that's a bit expected (at least in my eyes). Can't please all of the readers.

But, if you feel this wouldn't be a good feature, what new features would you personally like to see?

tbh that right there, quit putting the premium shit on such a high pedistool and let the smaller guys get some of those features. thats the main reason i seem hostile to Tapas is because they showed many times that they kinda don't care about the free to read section

I would like if I could schedule more than one page ahead of time.

Are you not allowed to? I'm not entirely sure if comics are different, but I can schedule several episodes at a time for a novel. I just keep making episodes and scheduling them for later times.

We used to be able to do this (not exactly with ink, but with the tip/support system before they removed that to add teh ink system)

I really miss being able to do that and I'm really sad they haven't put the option back.

yeah I heard about it, it was before I joined tapas, but the system they had back then did sound great.

i feel like this kinda negative, oppositional perspective is reductive and unhelpful

its worth remembering that tapas used to have a universally accessible support system that included unlockable episodes, so its not entirely off the table

but also, if they give the exact same earning mechanics to the community creators as to premium creators - and premium is the wrong word imo; theyre not superior, the difference is theyre on the payroll - it creates an issue where the payrolled creators are investing more (they have contracts, there are rights negotiations, idr what else) but getting the same stuff out of it, or where tapas is investing more into payrolled creators (i dunno how theyre paid? per page? per unlock?) than community creators, but for the same earning potential.

i dont think this is a terribly well-phrased argument, im tryna remember what ive heard @LordVincent say about the difficulties with opening up payrolled features for community creators, though he can prolly put it better than me

THAT SAID,

im actually gonna slightly side with you here. i dont wanna be hostile to tapas (esp not on a site they own, and bc i do like them as a platform) but of course theyre increasingly prioritising the things that earn them the most money. theyre a business under capitalism, this is totally natural and the only way they wouldnt sink, so i dont necessarily blame them, but i agree that it disadvantages beginner creators and de-prioritises quality while prioritising bankability. art under capitalism is a sad, sad state. but to change this, its not about getting the tapas staff to ~care about small creators (ftr we are all small creators here, payroll or no payroll), but about restructuring the system so that profit isnt a central goal.

that said, tapas isnt the worst when it comes to prioritising paid content (yet). they still pick up home grown creators to make premium series, for example.

also

i have updates scheduled til mid july?

I think there's a difference between caring about smaller creators—and offering them money.

If Tapas truly did not care about us "small fries", why would they put free content in the spotlight? Why would they put it into Staff Picks, the Daily Snack? Why bother putting our free trending content RIGHT NEXT to paid content, so all you have to do in the app is: swipe? It is apparent that the Tapas team does indeed care.

They just don't earn money with smaller creators.

I think the key in shirking negativity towards the team here would be to untie financial gains from the idea of success or being cared about. Because these are two different things that can, but don't have to go hand in hand. Coming from Wattpad, I know what it feels like when a team has stopped caring about all of its creators. Tapas is not even remotely the same. It's not ideal perhaps, yes. But outright claiming they don't care because it doesn't suit your personal (financial) needs? Uh. :no_mouth:


That said, a system like @imLucian proposes does sound interesting, especially if it once was part of this site. But, yeah: what would be the upside in applying for premium, then, once you have the needed following (and a finished draft if it's a novel)? I think having a support system to begin with—and offering even smaller fries like myself to unlock it early!—is something that already shows Tapas' appreciation for what all creators bring to the table here.

very true, i think i neglected to mention that bc i just havent been paying much attention to the tapas front page recently, so i wouldnt be able to make a solid argument. its also in tapas' best interest to nurture and encourage its homegrown creators, as theyre a great big pool to scout talent thatll keep tapas afloat in the long run

i still think it is true that tapas prioritises paid content, but this isnt due to the moral failings of anyone on staff. if they dont prioritise the work that earns them money, the company goes under and nobody gets paid. and thats bad and leads to neglecting some great art, but its a problem that reaches beyond the power of anyone on the staff.

Yeah, it's basically impossible to NOT neglect at least some people under capitalism. And if Tapas were to go about another angle, not functioning as a company per se anymore, or just giving smaller creators more opportunities to earn money (which would seriously impede Tapas' revenue): what would happen to the premium creators and their income?

If gaining more revenue for myself would mean taking it from people who have worked hard (and had some luck on top of it) to get where they are now, it wouldn't sit right with me at all.

I didn't want to enter another discussion like this because whenever I do, I become the target of "small creator rage" coming from... a few frustrated individuals. But here goes.

See, that's the thing. If all the premium benefits were released to free creators, it WOULD be unfair. Unfair to all of us that signed a contract to obtain them.

There are of course more reasons they should remain premium only. Primarily:

  1. Tapas can make sure that the series using their pay-to-read function have content that either belongs entirely to the original creators, or where the permission to use content owned by others has been obtained (for example, adaptation comics). I can imagine Tapas faces enough of an issue with fan content earning ad revenue despite this not being technically allowed from a legal standpoint. But they can't make it harder to get ad revenue because well... people would complain. Those of us that had to sit through the process of getting rolled into webtoon's ad rev share program know the horrors that would ensue. And even then a few fan comics would slip through. When there is a contract involved, Tapas are protected and have those grounds covered. When there is a process that involves contracts and that much communication, Tapas can also be sure that the content can be legally monetized.
  2. It allows for curation. Now, a lot of you may have some premium comics in mind that you personally believe are low quality either in the art region, story region, or overall. But you cannot deny that the majority of premium comics hold a fairly consistent quality throughout (within each comic) and update in a consistent manner. Similar episode length, specific update schedule. These are qualities customers can expect from premium comics and quite frankly part of what they pay for.

This being said, there is one premium "benefit" that I think should be released to free creators, and that is the ability to choose multiple genres. This is because it's not something I regard as a benefit, and certainly not something that should require signing a contract to obtain. It's something that would improve the user-friendliness of the site overall and help creators across the board better represent their comics. It helps give a better first impression of Tapas as a site and app and I don't see any good reason to keep it premium-only. It's usually a basic feature when sorting and searching comics/books/movies.

With that all in mind, let's shift focus for a moment. Being excluded from premium doesn't mean you can't better utilize ink to your advantage, and it also doesn't mean you can't provide early access.
Being an independent, uncontracted creator comes with its pros and cons.
On the negative side, everything's up to you. You have to create your own solutions using the tools at hand, and you have to make sure they succeed.
On the positive side, everything's up to you. The main person in control over your own success is you.

You can create an early access feed using tools available on Patreon. If you want, I can write up a guide on how to best do this based upon my own experience of years of using patreon and experimenting with different methods.
I also have a previously written guide on how to create and manage a tipping reward system on Tapas (so you can still make use of ink!) https://forums.tapas.io/t/advice-to-creators-how-to-get-more-tips/215925

I'm not going to directly reply to people here, but the argument about Premium creators irks me a little. Tapas have exclusivity rights for my work, and in return, they are pouring hours of staff time into editing and working on my content. That costs the company money, and there's no guarantee that any series will make a return on the money that they are pumping in either. Tapas have to be selective and have to curate who they choose to spend that time on. To get the services Tapas are providing right now, I'd have to pay thousands of dollars in the self-publishing industry normally.

I know talented novelists and artists who are not Premium Tapas creators, but who are making money from their work here, getting publicity and generally doing fantastic things for free on the site (and earning on the side through Patreon or selling on Amazon). I see this as another avenue for those creators who are treating Tapas as one stream of revenue. Of course, it is only going to work for those who are good at marketing themselves, just like the current system is, but there are definite positives with having fewer clicks between someone reading your work and parting with their money which will benefit those who are not already Big Time Creators (whatever those are).

(Separate issue - @LordVincent I'd be very interested to see how you manage your Patreon if you have time to type that up! )

you can totally do this! you can pick different times, or as I do often just schedule everything for the same time and episodes will be published in the same order you uploaded them.

Honestly, last year when I registered my account I was hoping this would be the thing when I saw that there's a donation option, but then figured out what was what at the time. This really could motivate me to make more stuff and schedule it, instead of going my usual way: "made the thing, impatience kicks in, published the thing immediately" xD

Of course, I see that there is concern about quality, etc. Well, they could let us enable it after a certain amount of subs, just like ad rev. In fact, my initial impression was that it was the next "achievement" after unlocking ad rev.

Quite often it's incredibly hard for people to get Patrons. Tipping on Tapas is cheaper than $1 and doesn't require registering on yet another website, figuring out payment schemes, etc etc.

YESS

Yes to multiple genres! But maybe limit to two, I could see how it would be disadvantageous if it were more than that.

How about a feature that shows recommended comics that are similar to the comic you're currently reading? It could be placed at the bottom-most part of the page of each episode, below the comments section. Similar to youtube's 'recommended videos' that shows at the right side of each video.

As valuable as all of this is, for some of us it wasn't the reason we signed into the deal and would not be enough on its own to convince us to sign one. There are many different reasons that users sign into these deals and they should all be kept in mind when making changes to the parts of the site that relate to it.

As for the Patreon matters, I will make a thread as soon as I find the time! Possibly tomorrow as I have the day off and don't have any plans with family and friends.