15 / 19
Jul 2018

It's taken me a while to try and figure out where i can talk to some people about web comics, but i guess this place will do great. So I honestly have a ton of questions because I, of course don't want to start a web comic and not even be ready and understand simple things like good paneling. ( which I don't really) I've ALWAYS wanted to make a comic but when i was little it was more of... Using already existing characters to make a fan comic. I never even did the first page because i lost interest obviously because it wasn't my characters. I used to feel like I could never make characters of my own and love them as much as i do the characters of popular shows etc. But i accidentally created someone just from a doodle... and I love him, and want to actually get serious about a web comic.

-I would prefer to write mostly on my own, because i want to accomplish a comic by myself. But honestly i'm not the best writer. but I do want to get better at writing. I don't know if anyone has any tips for practicing that sort of thing! it'd be helpful. I could get help from my friend but as I said I really would love to accomplish this on my own, at least for the most part.

-I was extremely excited when i created my character, but I do understand this is going to take time. I can't even expect to start the comic for a while because I don't think i'm ready, in my opinion. I did have a few ideas but the more time passes (only like a days, i've been drawing/thinking A LOT) the more i'm not that happy with the ideas i had for the theme of the story. I know the story should really come from me, and I used to be super creative in coming up with small stories even if they weren't long. So I don't know if people have tips for coming up with stories? but if not it totally makes sense considering it should come from me, in that case don't tell me!

-A big problem I have is I love these famous stories or characters too much, I'm afraid it'll seem like im heavily getting the ideas from them? and even if I did make a story that was inspired by one i love, i'm not sure how to exactly make it different heavily. Making a character for example. It sometimes would be hard for me to make a character because I would have my favorite character in my head too much, and return accidentally draw someone that probably reminds me a lot of them. Same for stories. I've always loved the super hero type of stories, MARVEL, Overwatch, as well as plenty of animes revolving around superheroes. I guess since there's already so many existing hero type of stories, it seems almost impossible to create an original one? because the ones i love are constantly in my head. Unless anyone thinks it's totally possible to create a completely at least almost original hero story. I mean.. I think it is, but i'm just not confident.

-Another tip i've been hearing in videos or on websites when doing research is to make your art style fairly simple. so that it's easier of course and you're not spending "years" drawing it. That sounds cool and all, but I would REALLY like to keep my art style. I don't expect to get a huge audience at first... but even then, I think i'm going to keep my art on the more "detailed" side, and not take the chibi or super simple route. This means i will obviously take more time on it, but I don't mind because i'm really excited to show, and mainly practice and develop my art style, But still keep it simple.
But is that the good route to take? honestly it depends on the person.. but what's your opinion?

-I'm scared of starting the comic, mainly because I never know how to start a story. Like what would be on the first panel of the first page? "Once upon a time" "in a far far away land". Or is it okay to start any way you want? I want my story to be dealing with some serious issues but also have a lot of goofy moments. So is it a smart choice to literally just start with my characters playing a nerdy card game at lunch time? (that was just an example I don't think i'd start like that.)

-I completely understand everything is going to take time, maybe even a VERY long time... But i've been drawing my whole life, i've always loved it and i always stop here and there. I always used to think .. "I can't imagine art being my career, Ew <_>" But after i graduated high school (very recently) I stopped drawing without even realizing it, and when i came back from being inspired by popular manga artists art, my hand wasn't stable and I couldn't draw as smoothly as i used to. I got back into the motion within a few days only, staying up almost all night, and literally working all day almost because i've been just so inspired recently. Posting art on Amino Drawing app, and seeing some people's reactions makes me REALLY happy. As I was saying I know this will take a long time... But I actually think I want art to be a career. I don't expect anything big now. But honestly the main thing I want right now is for people to love my comic, tell their friends. For people to draw fan art. That would probably explode my heart.

**I had so much to say, i didn't get every question in here, mainly because i couldn't keep up and remember everything. I guess calling each of these questions is kind of weird too. So I mainly would like to call it: "Asking for advice".

Thanks S0 Much!!

Please remember that i've always wanted to make comics, my whole life. So i'm not just coming here because i decided i wanted comics to be a huge part in my life in just a few days. I have a habit of reminding people of a lot of things. Often when i post on some forums, some people go straight to judging. "It's not going to happen over night." and that doesn't help anyone. I've seen it all over these forums. Please don't bring people down.

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I totally understand loving someone else's story or characters so much that you feel like you're drawing too much inspiration from them to the point of being unoriginal. I would say not to worry about having to be completely original. It is not possible to be completely original, since the entire content of our minds came at some point from an outside source. The problem is when too much of your inspiration is coming from only one source or from a set of very similar sources - then it is inevitable that you will feel like you are copying someone else's character / style / story / idea. The remedy is to find multiple, diverse sources of inspiration and integrate them into something new.

Concerning a simple vs. detailed art style, this really depends on you and the subject matter. Simple art styles in general will lend themselves better to comedies or light-hearted stories, while more detailed styles will lend themselves better to 'heavier', more dramatic stories or horror. But there are always exceptions.

Concerning starting a story, I would just look at the beginnings of a bunch of books / comics that you like and see how the 'pros' did it.

Concerning getting better at writing, I'm no guru but some important tips are:
- Make sure your characters (especially your protagonist) have significant flaws.
- Make sure there is conflict. And not just a little; a lot. Conflict is the base ingredient in a story.
- Write a broad outline and figure out the ending early on.

Hope some of that helped a little and good luck :slight_smile:

I read through your entire post and I believe you're overthinking a lot of it. Let loose! Have fun! The important part of doing this whole comic-creating thing is that you love it! (Unless you know, you're getting paid by someone)

Getting good with writing honestly just comes with practice and reading a diverse set of publications, novels, comics, etc.. You can find a lot of guidelines however to help you structure stories and so forth. A quick google search can get you plenty of articles.

Stories come to me naturally, sometimes out of the blue. But if you think about your character's background or current circumstances, an interesting plot make come forth from that.

A lot of creators will draw heavily from their favorite series. The first characters I ever created were rip-offs of Arthur, Carcaptor Sakura, and Monster Rancher characters to name a few. I mean, even to this day a lot of my characters are my versions of other things I've seen, I just make them my own ideal way. And some people have no problem with series that draw heavily from their influences; audiences love getting more content, especially if it fits a certain niche they enjoy.

Keep your style. DO WHAT YOU WANT. And once you do start getting into the swing of drawing a comic on a regular basis and feel like you need to simplify to be time efficient, that's okay too.

Generally for any sort of story you want to start with a hook to grab people's interests. It doesn't have to be in the same tone as the rest of the story but it's not a great idea to do a complete 180 in the next scene as that can be jarring for people.

But those are the main things I wanted to get across for now! Feel free to ask any follow up questions.

One place to start is Nitty Gritty Tips. Here are some key forums where multiple artists discuss topics you might have questions about, and several of these should include additional resources. (You can also just google things like "panel structure tutorial", or "how to place word bubbles" and find lots)



Some times the best way to learn is to just start trying to do the thing. And then as you bump into problems, you can find your own solutions, google for help, or bring your questions here and get more targeted advice and feedback. Good luck!

There are tons of resourced for writing advice you can find online, you can also seek out books to better learn the craft! That said, I think it's a good idea for impatient non-writers to try things like taking a short fairy tail and making it their own short comic. It's a great way to get in practice if you're having a hard time starting those bigger ideas. You'll learn a lot through small practice comics. And while it's fine to do it yourself, don't feel like working on a small project with a friend or other writer will hold you back. It's just another chance to learn, practice, and grow.

Kinda see the above advice. At the end of the day, you can't do it until you're doing it. So starting sooner is better than later. But you can choose a small join project with friends, or doing your own spin on a fairy tale, etc, as a way of making an easy start if the BIG EXCITING COMIC seems too daunting or you're stalled on ideas.

It's important not to just regurgitate existing works, but it's not a big deal if your influences are obvious. Especially if you need to start somewhere. Nothing is completely original, as they say, and recycling your favorite tropes and cliche's isn't a big idea. Try to make it your take on these ideas, though, no matter how inspired you are from existing properties. You might just need to get started and see what happens. You can always edit, or pivot, if you realize what you're making is too close to something that exists. ((and if you feel like your work is just too close to the real thing, you can choose not to monetize your comic, and then like fan comics, it's not a big deal))

At the end of the day you need to do you. A big part of making comics is learning how to draw fast, and how to cut corners. It's easy to underestimate how exhausting it can be when you haven't really done it before. That doesn't mean you have to go simple, just be aware. AND drawing for long periods of time can DAMAGE your body, so please take breaks, stretch, and otherwise care for yourself. (I myself draw in a semi realistic fashion and my comic is full color, so I know first hand how taxing that is)

Again, this might be something that you just try, and see how it goes. Maybe you'll find you can handle drawing in your usual way. Maybe you'll need to simplify. Maybe you'll find a happy in between! You can say "I want to do it this way," and go ahead and try that, but also keep an open mind to trying other things depending upon what you find!

Try not to start with an info dump, but yeah, pretty much start however you want. I hate figuring out how to start, so I pretty much jumped into things happening and trust my readers to pick up on things as we go.

I mean, usually when I see things like this, it's someone acting entitled. Sometimes even rude towards other creators. But obviously everyone deserves respect, and it's best to approach everyone with kindness, even if you don't love what they have to say. My experience on tapas and the forums has always been that it's mostly a very kind and supportive community. We want everyone to do well and grow.

Thank you for replying! I honestly didn't originally give the main character im planning any huge flaws, because for some reason i feel like "That happens ALL the time! it's common". But I know I LOVE when main characters have a bunch of flaws, things holding them back, so on. I actually recently heard about figuring out the end early on. I never thought about it before, but it really makes sense when you do, so i'll keep that in mind as well.

thanks for replying, I honestly don't know why i'm so worried because kind of what you explain. If i start to comic there's always room for adjustment, even to the art style etc. I think i'll have trouble grabbing people's attention at first, so i'm going to take some time on that, because that's the most important part to me! thank you (:

thanks so much for the super detailed advice to each "question". I'm definitely going to save some of it because it's some things i really need to remember and keep in mind lol. I'll probably start out with a small story (my sister suggested one shots) but maybe even smaller for now, since i've never made serious comics, there fore i don't really know great flow for panels. that said thanks a lot for the links!!

so my attention span is... not.. great....... so forgive me for skimming this and picking out the bits that Spoke To Me

also, before we start, WELCOME TO TAPAS! :tada: :tada: :tada:

there are lots of places to learn all this lovely juicy stuff!!!

i recommend, as a first port of call, scott mccloud. hes like, forgive me will eisner the father of comic theory and comics about comics. he has three comics that talk about comics - how to make them, what they are, where theyre going, their history. all sorts of lovely jubbly nerdy stuff. youll hear me and others like @niah146 gush about scott mccloud... regularly.

understanding comics is his first book, its a great introduction to the medium - it introduces lots of concepts abt the mechanics of comics and the nature of panelling and panel transitions, and then spins off into history and wider art theory and lots of stuff. i first read it about a year ago when i was just starting to take comics seriously, and it blew! my mind!

then theres reinventing comics (harder to find online, but look in your local library), which looks more into comic history and potential for the future. also an inspiring read, but a lot of its a bit dated.

and then making comics, (you can find it online if u rootle enough) which could be a good start for you - it covers the basics of actually making comics. i havent read this one yet, but ive heard its a really good beginner crash course.

besides that
1: look around the forums, people often have discussions about panelling, composition, word bubbles. @SleepingPoppy beat me to mentioning the nitty gritty tips :confused: rude
2: look at comics you admire, and applying what you learn, study what they do. and copy it.
3: ask!!!!!!! you can always ask for feedback or advice on the forums, and theres lots of people that will help you out :slight_smile:

tbh i think writing on your own is the best thing to do when starting out - to be crosstrained in the art and writing of comics is a really good thing, and doing all bits yourself makes for smth harmonious (not that collabs cant also be harmonious, but it takes more time and experience to mesh)

and yknow what? every writer is a shit writer to begin with. hemingway? there was a time when hemingway couldnt write for SHIT. SHAKESPEARE? that dude couldnt even READ in the very beginning (yknow, bc he was a baby). everyone starts somewhere, and you learn how to write by writing. and reading. read. read a lot.

totally definitely absolutely start with short stories and short comics - and have fun with it! pick stuff you arent too attached to, fun weird ideas to fuck about with. derivative structures, worlds, stories, characters... just do something short you can crap out and move on to the next thing, and experiment as you go. if you see something a writer or comic creator does that you really like, steal it, whack it about, see what makes it tick, and move on.

you will never be ready, in your opinion. definitely start slow and small, ease yourself into it - do not start with a 5000 page epic. please dont. - but do just start. the first few things you make are allowed to be entirely awful, theyll be yours, theyll have that glimmer of you that youre gonna polish as you go until it shines.

someone on the comic podcast 'dirty old ladies' (highkey recommend, btw) once said "everyone has 200 awful comic pages inside of them, and the only way out is through." so start, and embrace the crap because its part of the learning process.

be derivative!!! fuck it!!!!! everythings a ripoff of something else!!!! the handmaids tale is a ripoff of 1984, the lion king is a ripoff of shakespeare and the bible, star wars is a rip off of ninja(? kung fu? kinda thing) movies, narnia is a ripoff of the bible... ya get me?

that said, your inspirations are all very popcultural. this is fine and good and great, but id recommend widening your scope, it could solve your dilemma here. look into what influenced the marvel or overwatch writers - what stories inspired them? and what stories inspired those stories? and what stories... etc. read some classics, watch some old movies, look at some art. read some mythology. read some psychology. talk to people. steal their stories. add some funky scifi junk. make it your own.

the key to originality is a wide pool of references. its not about an all new ingredient, its about a new recipe.

then keep it! that advice is for people further down the line, looking to take their comicry into a career. and there are plenty of comic artists who do really intricate, painterly work - in webcomics, and working for marvel and DC. the only way for you to know whats best for altering your style, imo, is to get working and get experimenting and see what you like

at this point, dont make comics for anyone else. dont think about target audience, trends, demand... whats the story you want to tell? how do you want to tell it? do that.

draw out a plan of the entire plot before you really start. this means you can work out the kinks, figure out the order of things, and select from this wide array of events a good place to start.

look at how other stories do it! how do your favourite comics start? your favourite movies? look into story structure and read stories with good structure and pick apart (and steal) what they do.

like, basically, yeah

that sounds like a really good start :slight_smile: look into other media that goes for that tone, and see what they do.

its really cool to see someone so passionate about comics, i really hope my advice and these forums help you on your way :smiley: ill always be happy to give feedback or advice on anything you post here!

I want to die of happiness sorry, mostly because you noticed how passionate i was. and that's kind of what i was trying to show writing this whole forum! Honestly there's so much you said I don't even have a specific reply. but i'm bookmarking this page because I need to remember all the great advice! I planned on posting on Line Webtoon but I think i'm going to post on Tapastic as well.

*I have another question as well, and if ANYONE wants to answer.. I use FireAlpaca (Medibang too sometimes) and so i'll create a new page for comics (of course) but is there like a certain length and width, resolution, etc. that is recommended?

I say this a LOT, and I dont say it passing judgement, but more as a reminder- because there are creators who want to hear "the easy way to get to"- especially younger creators who put all their eggs in one basket thinking that their comic is blow up within a short period of time. If it happens- more power to them, but if it doesnt happen: be patient, buckle down and put in the work to build & grow your audience. Dont get discouraged if things dont go the way you had hoped...even I have to listen to my own advice at times, coz I get discouraged along this journey.

Just group your ideas together and figure out how you want your story to flow and where you want to go with it. For me, whenever I feel myself getting amped up about an idea I have for a story- especially after I've put it on the back burner for a week or so, then I know it's a good idea to build something on. As for your idea being similar to an established thing- it happens sometimes, but make sure you arent directly deriving your material from an established source; readers will let you know.

As for art style- you do what you're comfortable with...if it takes you a minute longer to do the work, build a buffer(a number of pages already done before you start posting), before you run the comic. Sometimes things happen, and you may feel like you dont want to get behind in your updates and let your readers down or lose some...my style isnt something that I can whip out in 3 hrs, so I try to build a buffer when I have the chance.

Lastly, have fun with what you're creating..!

Everyone have been giving you an helpful tips, so maybe I just add a little bit.

just practice by doing a short story or short comic, like a 15 pagers. If you like the existing characters, there's no fault in making a fanfic for a while until you can cook out your own story.

This is your early stages, and no one would blame you for not being perfect. You just have to have the courage to shows your works to the world, and be proud of your achievement.

Practice make prefect, and you'll get better as time flies. Either your artistic skill or your writing skill.

Good luck for you :slight_smile: .

When I was interested in starting a webcomic, but didn't know how to do it, what I did was go to TopWebComics2, click on anything that looked interesting, and read as much as I could. I did this for a few weeks, just reading a whole bunch of comics and getting a feel for how they started and what I liked. If I was interested, I'd take note of what had made me intrigued and keep reading. If I was bored, I'd pay attention to what had bored me. If I thought "oh that's neat" but then found myself never coming back to look at the comic again, I'd try to figure out what it was missing -- why wasn't I interested enough to come back?

For the comics I kept reading, I paid attention to which ones I lost interest in and which ones I excitedly looked forward to every update. What needs to be in an update for it to be satisfying? How fast or slow should the story move?

I read a lot of Scott McCloud and a lot of other comicking books and took a lot of comicking classes and read Story and read the DC Comics Guide to Writing Comics1 and I was hired by a friend to draw her script and got to study her writing style in the process, and all of those things were VERY HELPFUL (I especially recommend Story if you don't mind a long read), but the places where it all really made sense for me was just, looking at other comics and learning from what they did, and what worked, and what absolutely didn't work. Almost all the decisions I made at the beginning of my comic were based on what I'd seen in other comics.

And yet, despite all of that, after I finished Chapter One I could see things in the story that I could've done better -- and what I realised is the only way I could've learned those lessons was by making Chapter One. It didn't matter how much I read and studied -- there was only so much I could learn that way. I needed to make comics in order for it all to really click.

(That said, here's a post I made when someone asked me for Webcomic Starting Advice2 which I still stand by!)

You're welcome, no problem :).

And one more thing since a couple people have mentioned Scott McCloud's books - I happen to be almost done reading McCloud's "Making Comics: Storytelling Secrets of Comics, Manga, and Graphic Novels", and can confirm it's really helpful. I definitely recommend it.

More or less the answer to all your concerns is you just have to do it, you don't get better at anything by worrying about it. Just remember "Suckin' at somethin' is the first step towards bein' sorta good at somethin'"

aspect ratio (length and width) doesnt matter too much, but id go for A4 dimensions myself. go for A4 sizing (at the very least) as well - youll have to downsize to upload to tapas and webtoons, but working larger makes for better images. 300dpi should do for resolution.

First, I admire your passion and desire to create comics. I firmly believe if you want something enough, you'll find a way, or you'll make an excuse. And you're not making any excuses here ^^ I find that an incredibly good omen.

Every comic artist has gone through a beginning filled with uncertainty and doubt. I believe that doubt never leaves, but you can cut through it with a single unshakeable certainty of wanting to make comics.

I'll go through each of your points and share my experience to the best of my ability.

Practicing Writing

  • Writing for comics is distinctly different from writing a Novel or Stageplay. Primarily because our work resides in the visual sphere, like Screenplays.
  • For this reason, I recommend you begin by learning the foundational elements of Storycraft. i.e. Plot Structure, Character, Setting, and other technical details building off of that.
  • For the longest time, I didn't believe myself to be a writer, even while I was making comics, but it's important to declare that you are. More than that, it's important to declare you are a Storyteller. Your medium is words and images, not just words like writers. We have to be both Artist and Writer, and we can be both.
  • To Get Started, consider reading Story by Robert McKee. I've made three threads where i'm sharing what I learnt from the book if you'd like to see summaries before considering the book: [1 Art of Story], [2 Fundamental Story Structure] [3 Setting and Cliches]

Coming Up With Stories

  • Inspiration for stories comes from three places:
    >+ Memory: Explore your past and relive memories to find pertinent emotions that you want to express in your story. It's not so much what happened as how it made you feel. If you know this you can craft a story that generates the same emotion.
    >+ Imagination: The fragments of your experiences and things you've learnt gets connected with Imagination. It's when you take disparate ideas and find ways they fit together that you generate ideas through Imagination.
    >+ Fact: This helps you find something to say. Stories can be about any topic; therefore whatever the literal content of your story is, you can research and learn more about so that you can speak of it with accuracy, even as you might bend, transform, and push it further than its basic facts.
  • Keep in mind that your Premise is not the same as your Story's Controlling Idea ("Theme").
  • When you Create, you're starting from a Premise, which is an open-ended idea that gets you excited, so you take your character and you begin to explore it. It's only upon completing a first draft that you can look back and see waht the Theme is. The theme is something the story reveals to you, not something you begin with because a story helps you discover yourself. It's through self-awarness and the humility that comes with that that we can write good stories.
  • As for what helps with the first draft, I'd need more time and room to explain it lol but it's all detailed in the book I mentioned above, Story.

Originality

  • This is an understandable worry starting out. Watching Neil Gaiman's Commencement Address on youtube will be a huge motivator, but here is a paraphrased [or memorized] quotes from it:
  • "The urge starting out is to copy, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. Many of us only find our voice after we've sounded like a lot of others."
  • What's important to keep in mind is that you have what nobody else has: You. Your voice, your ideas, your thoughts, and emotions. By virtue of being you, what you create is uniquely yours because it won't be exactly the thing you love, even though starting out it may be fairly close.
  • You can take everything you love and pull it together into a story that uniquely follows your protagonist. I personally don't believe you need to focus on being different, just focus on being true and honest with yourself, your specific characters, and their story within a specific setting. You find the more precise and specific you are in your knowledge of the characters and the setting, the more original you will sound.
  • There is nothing new under the sun. That is to say yes these archetypal stories have existed since humanity began telling stories but there is most definitely a way to tell YOUR specific story.

Art Level of Detail

  • Make the art you want to make. As you start making the comics and through practice and experimentation find out your workflow, you'll naturally walk the path you need to take to find your optimal method. Don't be afraid to transform if you feel the urge to.

Starting

  • Hmm. I wouldn't worry about the specific start. Not before you have a commanding grasp of the big picture. The story and plot as a whole, even as an outline. Details can change, but the broad strokes of the story are what you ought to worry about first.
  • Especially with a starting comic, my recommendation is to start small. I made two small one-shots before attempting a long form comic.

Art as Career

  • Until my second year in College, I thought I was going to be a Psych major cause that would put me in a respectable career path. All the while, I had been drawing every single day since I was 10 and didn't realize it's what I'm meant to do. I've fixed that.
  • For me life as a freelance artist has meant working in commissions and more recently adoptables for the last 9 years. Only in the last Two years has it earned me enough to get by. This is not meant to be a discouraging note, but as you understand that it will take time for something in the arts to become big enough to support you.
  • For a time you may need to split your time between making the comic and doing work that will pay bills, as a lot of us here are doing.
  • I firmly believe that as long as you keep that desire to touch the audience, to connect with your readers, to share your story--it doesn't matter how long it takes. Persistence and commitment is the only path to success and I believe you have it in you.

I'll part with this: You learn to write by writing, and we write so much more than we will ever use. But everything produced could have a place in the future. So stash away all the ideas and choose only the ones that ring with a feeling of Truth to you.

I look forward to seeing what you create. Best of luck my fellow comic artist! :heart:

It truly makes me happy that you say I have a passion and desire to create comics. I remember creating random comics when i was little which i loved, but they were so bad if I can remember them now, especially because i used characters already existent. So it was technically fan art. But i still felt excited to draw more to the story and continue creating dramatic moments. (of course i was terrible at drawing at the time and couldn't draw interesting looking poses with emotion!)
But thank you for replying, I really did book mark this page to see what everyone has said. At times in just the past few days it's crossed my mind that maybe this will be too hard for me to do? Especially when i get sad at times. But something about creating comics, really just makes me so inspired. I even want to start doing commissions but sadly not sure where to start.

Well, honestly this whole forum has inspired me it kind of gave me an idea, that i became super excited about. As you said, a Premise. Which I didn't even know! But this was all very encouraging, I even went ahead and put a lot of information in some sticky notes. I honestly don't know how long I will take before I make my first comic, whether it's 10 pages. Or 100. But i'm trying to make it happen soon!

Anyways.. Thanks so much. I didn't expect another person to reply but all the tips help!

I would advise you to do what I’m doing.

Save that story you love for when you can really do it justice.

I’m not planning on doing the story I love for many years. Because I know if I put it out now I would not be satisfied with the results. It’s not as unpleasant as it seems. You will have other comics and projects to keep you busy as you patiently wait for the one.

I had to kill a story I loved to death once because it turned to shit due to my inexperience. I never even got to write that story. It never left the solitude of my brain. I don’t want to kill another. And I’m sure you don’t too.

I thought about saving the one i'm really excited for, for a while. but for years?! I mean that might just be the best amount of time. Thank you