Storytelling - Red Herrings or Hints?

[shazzbaa]

So you have a comic, and in that comic, there's something that the readers -- and characters -- don't know yet. It hasn't been revealed yet, but it will be revealed later. It's not the main mystery, but it's a big deal, like how a certain kind of magic works, or an important political conspiracy -- an actual question the story is uncovering. Your readers have a few theories, and some of them are wrong.

Something related to this question happens in the story and your characters try to figure out why. You have a choice:

• Your characters get closer to the truth. "I wonder if this has anything to do with that political conspiracy...." they wonder. A hint!
• Your characters offer an explanation, but they're way off-base. "Maybe it's because [wrong theory]....?" they suggest. A red herring.

I see pros and cons to both! The hint could help build up towards the truth, but it also might weaken the actual moment you learn the truth by making it feel too obvious. The red herring might make the truth less obvious, but it also might make the truth feel like it comes out of the blue -- especially if the audience got really attached to an incorrect theory. On the other hand, will they take the character's word for it? Do audiences tend to believe what characters suggest, or do they tend to discard it, subconsciously assuming that's too easy and expecting the real truth to be a twist?

This is definitely a thing where there's not One Right Answer and it depends on the story, but I'm curious how you guys approach this! What factors would you consider in making that decision? Does anyone have experience with this kinda plot question -- what worked or didn't work for you?

[Down_the_Rabbithole]

Personally, I try to be subtle with it. Like something seemingly insignificant happens in the background or I give conversations double-meanings. I like to take some hints and some red herrings and mix them around. I think that throws the readers off, but I don't know.

[AnnaLandin]

Hmm. Interesting question, and well worth thinking about!

I think one of the strengths of having a group of characters engaged in finding the right answer is that you can play this both ways. You can have some of them find true hints, and you can have one or two of them hit on the wrong explanation, and that ongoing conflict might actually fuel the search for the answer.

Honestly, I think both things work in different situations and for different reasons! Like, using the red herring approach can build up to a shocking reveal later when it turns out that whoah, your character was entirely wrong about this!

On the other hand, dropping true hints gives your story a solid direction to go in. It might be a political conspiracy! Well, let's go somewhere and learn more about that conspiracy, then!

I do a lot of dropping true hints in Grassblades - mostly because one of the main actors keeping secrets from the readers is Masahiro himself! He knows stuff, and has experienced stuff, that he is keeping very close to his chest for various reasons, and I drop bits and pieces of that into the story and turn it into kind of a Hansel and Gretel breadcrumb trail through the story.

I throw in the odd red herring as well, but only when I feel like it serves a purpose. The pace of my story is already decompressed, and throwing in too many red herrings would slow it to a crawl as they chase the wrong leads.

[indagold]

I tend to give hints depending on the story or it's just outright, the readers know it but the characters don't. I even tend to make it hilarious, my comic Welcome Back takes place in a dreamworld and only one person knows they're dreaming and they have to deal with the weirdness of the world while everyone else just accepts it as the norm.

[respheal]

I think it's pretty important to give clues about the truth as the story goes along so it's not entirely out of the blue, or doesn't feel deus-ex-machina-y. But at the same time, you're right in that if you're trying to play up a mystery it shouldn't be too obvious. There's a delicate balance to strike. As for characters suggesting theories, unless we're given reason to believe that the character's opinion is unreliable, readers tend to take what characters say at face value.

My favorite thing is when you learn the truth, and then that suddenly colors everything you know about the story so far, like "OH NO SO THAT'S WHAT THAT MEANT/WAS!" because the truth was already there, the reader was just missing some small key.

Red herrings -- I like the type where the herring is actually an important or true thing, but its importance is way overestimated, distracting from the truth of the matter. In my opinion, a good red herring isn't a lie, but a distraction.

[dojo]

I've actually been doing the "offering explanation but it's way off base" in one of my comics (I won't point out which one on the chance one of my readers sees this, and it'd be major spoilers for said comic). Basically said character doesn't really understand anything either, and is basically presenting as knowing the answers to a thing when they actually know absolutely nothing. It's their nature, because in their position they've always been required to have all the answers, so being thrust in a situation where they have no effing clue scares them, so they cover it up with baseless knowledge in an attempt to comfort those around them, thus "lying" to both the characters around them and the reader. It'll totally bite them in the ass further down the line when everyone learns they were totally 100% wrong. In this case it more has to do with the character themselves than anything else.

But yeah I think ultimately the decision should mostly be taking the characters themselves into consideration. Why would they come to whatever wrong conclusion it is, why would they lie/be vague about something, why would they straight up ignore something that might actually be the truth, etc. If it makes sense for the character, it'll make sense for the story. The character is not me, so how they react shouldn't be how I would react, unless I gave them a similar wavelength to my own.

This is my preferred method for handling things, but I think that's mostly because of the types of stories I prefer writing, which are all very heavily character driven, regardless of what world they're in.

[alaingrey]

I think you need a little of both to lead the reader to the proper conclusion, but not make it feel obvious. If everything leads to one conclusion, everyone will expect the conclusion. If there's only red herrings and the actual conclusion is never hinted at, the reader will feel cheated.

I've been really intensely watching "Murder, She Wrote", the old series with Angela Lansbury, and I think a lot of the stories are pretty masterful at this. There's enough clues you can figure out who the murderer is, but there's enough red herrings that you can be surprised and still feel a bit of suspense. The show is formulaic enough that you tend to figure out the stories the more you watch, but sometimes it uses its formula to trick you, as well.

[ConradComics]

As a reader, I prefer hints. I like trying to figure out plots and I'd rather my breadcrumbs be truthful. If there is to be misinformation, especially from an antagonist, I'd rather it be something I already know to be false because of my wider point of view.

As a storyteller, I am constantly seduced by the power of misinformation and red herrings. It's just such a great tool. There is nothing out of character with one being wrong about something. Guessing wrong is a perfectly natural action, especially for a protagonist, since they rarely know what the reader knows. A lie is also a perfectly natural act for an antagonist, for similar reasons. Where I try to check myself is that if what I'm adding is truly misinformation, then I also try to add some clue; right away, for the audience only, that shows it be such, even if I don't reveal all of the details immediately. I know as a reader, I would appreciate that.

On a side note, I think a type of herring that irks me as a reader is the okay-this-should-be-revealed-NOW-but-won't-be-because-it's-not-time-yet troll. An example of this would be a character named Will who has a secret identity, someone asks him point blank about this identity and Will simply greets this person in such way that the question is not answered. That chaps me something fierce. It comes off as unnatural. If someone asks are you this person, you naturally either answer, 'No, who is that person?' (Even if it's a lie. In fact, I'd rather the person out-right lie in this situation.) or you answer, 'Yes, I am that person.' Dun, dun, dun. Skirting the issue because of timing just tells me you know it's the worst kept secret of the story, but you're purposefully dragging it out to be a troll and that can alienate an audience (or at least me, LOL : )

[punkarsenic]

i like hints when theyre really subtle, like (ugh nerdy example) in the earlier seasons of rtd's doctor who, theyd drop in mentions of torchwood or bad wolf in the background, to the point that theyd be missed or dismissed by most viewers - and then theyre revealed as plot relevant later on. It gives you that little satisfying click without taking away from the surprise.

[keii4ii]

I think you can do both at the same time. For example, a character analyzes the available clues and forms a theory. The theory turns out to be wrong, but something about the analysis/ the character's thought process provides hints for the readers, or at least accomplishes something other than prolonging the mystery. My feeling is that even red herrings shouldn't turn out to be ultimately irrelevant.

[Michelle]

I like to use a combination of both, that way the readers don't fall into a pattern of knowing every hint will produce answers, or expect everything to be a trick. With red herrings, the important thing is that it should still move the story forward. Even if it's not the correct answer, it should lead to a reveal of new information, and not create a total dead-end that the plot has to clumsily reverse itself out of.

I'm not a fan of twists, which I think of as a plot development with zero foreshadowing or logical setup. A twist, to me, relies solely on surprising the reader, but doesn't serve to deepen the plot much after that-- kind of like a cheap horror jump scare. So while an ending can be totally surprising, it's always better if there are hints and clues the reader can look back on that lend credibility to the reveal.

[shazzbaa]

Personally, I try to be subtle with it. Like something seemingly insignificant happens in the background or I give conversations double-meanings.

i like hints when theyre really subtle, like (ugh nerdy example) in the earlier seasons of rtd's doctor who, theyd drop in mentions of torchwood or bad wolf in the background, to the point that theyd be missed or dismissed by most viewers

I agree with this being a cool way to start to introduce hints of important things, but what I'm talking about is more like -- okay here's an example!

Let's say you have a lot of visible tension between a few major political figures that you've been dropping little subtle hints about. You know it's a conspiracy, and everyone will find that out for sure in a couple of chapters, but right now readers are split as to whether they think those figures are up to something fishy, or jealous for romantic reasons. One of them is assassinated as coverup in that conspiracy, and when the protagonists learn of the assassination, they might suspect "...I guess the duchess just got jealous," (a misdirection) or "...you don't think they're hiding something, do you?" (a hint to the truth).

(Though as an aside: I have a suspicion that readers are more likely to be skeptical of a character saying "it's probably just this" than "you don't think it's this, do you?")

A lot of what I'm hearing is makin me think the primary determining factor for most seems to be "does casting suspicion on the wrong thing actually lead them in a useful direction?" So that if pursuing the person who's most likely to be jealous would be a useful lead and move the story in an interesting direction with interesting consequences, that can be a cool way to slowly unravel that question -- but if it would just be a matter of "looks like someone got jealous" and later you start realising "WAIT NO THAT WAS WRONG its actually a conspiracy" then that's a clumsy and unnecessary misdirection?

[Down_the_Rabbithole]

Personally, I think it has a lot to do with how you frame it and how plausible the misdirection could be. If, in your example, this duchess character seems petty and shallow, then thinking her motives are pure jealousy and nothing else could be effective without being clumsy. Of course, you do have to drop those tiny, subtle hints that the duchess is smarter than she lets on, otherwise the twist comes out of left-field with nothing to back it up.

[NickRowler]

I honestly use both.

I like the whole concept of "Can we believe everything the character says? Can they be trusted?"

Like, what if you had a character where every other word was a lie (or red herring). Like how I have a character who says they are homeless even though earlier they were shown inside a building (which is actually their home). And there are other parts where he he slips up, having his body language not match what he is saying.

I think the major issue with having lying characters is that the narrative can get inconsistent and people might think you can't keep track of your own story. Or at least, that is what I worry about.

On the other hand, I also like to put hints in my story, with a lot of them maybe unnoticeable unless you reread it. I guess I sort of like the idea of a story/mystery slowly unfolding instead of dumping it all at once. Tho one of my issues with this is that if you decide to change something but already made a reference to it, then you do have actual contradictions. I do have a character who was hinted at in chapter 01 but fleshed more out in chapter 06. However, in the first chapter, he appears as a 10 year old while in the later chapter, he appears as a 13 year old. The reason his age was changed was to fix an even bigger contradiction.

[Kamikaze]

When it comes to hints or red herrings I try to keep them out of the mouths of my characters as much as possible. More can be conveyed about secrets and reveals when a character goes silent or stifles their own voice. Most folks when confronted with a secret they don't want revealed will do just about anything to protect it - including saying nothing.

[jacintawibowo]

I had a perfect example of this in Blood Moon (one-off comic that's finished for now) where one of the main characters starts metamorphosizing for what appears to be one reason (wrong theory), when really it's another reason.
My approach to it is to have the contention (the "right theory") since the beginning and always have the narrative support this theory. Characters can come up with whatever explanation they want, but in the end it's the narraive that shows wheter they are right or wrong.
For Blood Moon, readers had a hunch that the main character was wrong with their theory, but were shocked to find the reveal. Whenever I show the comic to people on a whim irl they're always shocked to find the theory was wrong, but delighted at the ending. Which is a pretty good reaction!

[Damatris]

Ah man, I love when stories execute foreshadowing well! That moment when things fall in place... It's just such a great feeling of revelation.

I agree with people that even the red herrings are something that should be leading to somewhere instead of only prolonging the mystery. It's kinda funny that I'm once again reading Fullmetal Alchemist atm since that's one series that handles red herrings wonderfully. Every time there's a theory that ends up being wrong or only tangentially right it's still prompting characters to move in the right direction, keeping the story moving and mystery slowly unraveling.

I think dropping hints is in some way easier to write since it doesn't run the risk of confusing readers. Although, it doesn't mean that people won't construct their own false theories but shattering those is fun. I think I have half accidentally thrown some red herrings of my own in my comic from what I've seen people theorizing about what's to come. I didn't really mean to set it up that way but since a lot of characters don't have all the facts and are working independently furthering their ambitions, it did naturally end up like that. It's all going to lead to the same place buuut looks like it won't where people are thinking it will be.

Hints are really important to prepare for plot twists/revelations so it won't seem like things happened out of nowhere without any context. It should be possible to go back and see the points where there were small mentions of things to come. It's also the best way to encourage people to read the story more than once since it will be possible to find new layers to it with each read through. I don't know how many have read Kingkiller Chronicle novels by Patrick Rothfuss (please release the last one already) but oh man, those are so full of hints and interconnecting things that it's almost necessary to read them more than once.

[efdvorsky]

Definitely agree both have their place in the narrative. Red herrings can work if handled well (has enough evidence, or if said, is just a character's own biased opinion that is part of their development) and can show how lost a character can be in the situation and can help identify the reader with them...if they trust them enough.

But a writer should also be aware of dropping necessary hints or foreshadowing when necessary so when the reader goes back, they realize it was there all along.

It's a balance that can work if you know what you're doing rather than throwing things against the wall and seeing what sticks.

[leoeffizy]

both works but you would have to be careful about it or else the pay off wont work. i suggest you look at stories that have genuinely shocked you or how your favourite writers do it. i will use j.k rowling as an example. in chambers of secret harry and thee gang gradually learn about the mystery of the chamber , most of what they discover is truth but she gives us a red herring with the whole heir of slytherin sub plot which made us to only search the slytherins and disregard all of hogwarts. you can play with both but if you want to see plot twists done well i will recommend
harry potter series
fight club
primal
sixth sense
anime
bleach [soul soceity arc]
code geass
madoka magica
danganronpa
am sure you get the gist. just go study, you will see what works and what doesnt personally.i just put thee ones that worked for me cause i didnt see them coming.

[mintycanoodles]

I think working with webcomics you've also got to deal with how little people tend to notice. I mean, chances are readers aren't reading terribly deep, so how obvious do you make your hints? I know I've got a few I thought I was being pretty blatant with, but they've flown totally under the radar.

so how subtle should you be without risking your hint going unnoticed entirely? I sure don't know