Website updates and collecting feedback

lol IDK if it was aimed at that but my conspiracy post was not me trying to be deliberately inconsiderate of Tapas staff and their own goings-on.

Listen, guys, I understand that right now, the world is sort of on fire and the economy isn't in a stable place. People are losing their jobs, being required to work from home, or being made to go into work in dangerous conditions due to being 'essential'. People are stressed and have even more going on in their lives outside of work. I understand that Tapas staff has been working diligently since that update was made (and yes, it hasn't been that long since the update was made, and two of those weeks have been spent with worldwide lockdowns being made and the workforce being ground to a halt). The current COVID-19 crisis has certainly put a wrench in a lot of Tapas staff's plans, both related and unrelated to the office.

But as time goes on, things will be forgotten. Priorities will shift. And now's an important time to reflect and remind Tapas staff that just because the discussion isn't updating every 30 seconds, doesn't mean it's not a problem anymore. I've already seen a multitude of questions and concerns in here that have gone skipped over, even after being repeated, entire threads even where Tapas staff has left the thread to die with no response. It might not be their intention, but from a user's perspective, it looks like the equivalent of ghosting.

Again, I understand the coronavirus has slowed a lot of things down, and even without it the Tapas staff has a lot of moving parts and stuff going on.

But it's the lack of communication that's got me and many others beating our heads against walls. And when that communication does happen, it's basically up to a coin flip whether or not we see a corresponding action.

The point of my post was to highlight some major issues with the current ecosystem of Tapas and how it's been slowly but surely becoming a scrubbed down corporate version of the vibrant place it used to be. Because even if Tapas isn't going to make comments on the subject, either due to not being able to due to the current worldwide crisis OR as simply as not being able to because yes, there are certain things Michael and Yoon apparently "can't comment on", that doesn't mean we should just forget about it and put up with it.

Despite demand, banners haven't been brought back. Novel formatting tools are still as watered down as can be. Thumbnails beyond the series landing page are no longer visible. Tags aren't even visible on the comics anymore (I'm feeling really bad for Harry Bogosian rn, a lot of his storytelling in A BETTER PLACE was done with tags you could read and interpret and it made it a really cool ARG - 'Alternate Reality Game' - experience of sorts. And I know he's not the only person to do that.) The front page is constantly the same genre/series that rotate through the banners and Trending and Recommended sections, regardless of whether they're Premium or just 'mainstream' free to read comics (again, Sarah's Scribbles, Fail By Error, etc. all of which I still keep seeing on every Comedy genre comic landing page, regardless of how small fish that comic may be). The music player isn't available on the app.

Basically any kind of individual expression that added to the unique experiences of each comic on this website has been scrubbed down so clean that all you can see is bone. Maybe it's presumptuous, but from my perspective, it's very obvious that Tapas is trying to bundle us all together with the same styles, formatting, and expression so that they can make it easier to sell us as a whole to investors.

And I feel that if Tapas' can reserve the right to give bare bones customer service voice explanations to very reasonable and justified questions, then the community should reserve the right to make informed decisions about their future here and whether or not Tapas is a place where they can grow.

I just happen to be doing some of the informing here. You can say that it's based purely on emotion, but the fact of the matter is, I've been here since 2013/14. I'm not some newbie coming in with conspiracy theories or some asshole being an asshole for the sake of it, I've been here for six-going-on-seven years - and stuck by Tapas and all its decisions through a whole darn lot of it - and so as a result, I've seen a lot of shit, from both Tapas and the community, for better and for worse, that has continued to shape and reshape my perspective and opinions of the website, based on a solid history of repeated experiences with the platform. And I'm not the only one - the proof is also in the veteran artists who would have been here just as long, if not longer than me, who've already left as a result of Tapas' actions and behavior these past few years. Just as I have the right to either leave this website or ride it out hoping for better (which obviously includes a lot of demanding btw lol), so too does everyone else here, and you can't make that decision without being informed.

To be perfectly honest, the lot of you like to say that our opinions don't matter as much, because the forums are only made up of about 50-100 people. But on the flipside, Tapas should consider themselves lucky that the forums aren't more commonly used by the public at large. They think it's stressful when 50 of us are bumping the same chat for hours on end? Try thousands. Because I guarantee you we'd be seeing a lot more mixed opinions if the forums were more accessible or advertised. Why do you think we see less complaints about LINE Webtoons compared to Tapas? Because they don't have a forum. Anyone who makes complaints about LINE comes here, for god's sakes. Give people an outlet, and you'll see a lot more discussion unfolding.

The fact of the matter is, I have the right as a user who brings free to read content to the platform to disagree with Tapas' methods, as well as their responses to said methods when they're called into question, as much a right as all of you, because like many of you, we're providing a service to Tapas with the traffic we bring in, many new faces who may have never even HEARD of Tapas without our help, alongside the work we post so that the website can actually have comics to showcase to the public. Back in the day, before Premium was a thing, it was Prime, and those users were only different in the sense that they got Ad Revenue. Then Premium came along and Ad Revenue became accessible to everyone, which is great - but on the flipside, a lot of our work is now getting intentionally buried in a system designed to favor the mainstream and trendy, because it brings in the most money. But they would have potentially never gotten the seed money to expand their services to include Premium contracts if it wasn't for the massive library of comics and reputable creators we had here. Could you imagine Comic Fury trying to go for investment options? To be fair, it's run by one guy, but I'm p sure the only reputable comic I've seen on that platform is Keiiii's Heart of Keol. And I'm not entirely certain if they're still mirroring there.

Yes, Tapas is a company. They need to make money.

But it's the way they've gone about it that's entirely disingenuous. I would have no qualms with Premium series if we weren't being made to feel that it's Premium or nothing. I would have no issues with the ink system if it wasn't so questionable in its conversion process that has already raised many eyebrows. I would have no issues with a few buggy updates here and there, Facebook just updated yesterday and its app has been baloney since this morning.

But it's the lack of transparency and communication. The fact that every answer to each question is either a generic, soft-boiled customer-service-rep response, or a rigid "sorry we can't answer that question". So where are the people who can? Why are we seeing less and less from the PR side of Tapas as time goes on and why is it that we only see it when shit hits the fan? Why can't there be good news, either of the current goings-on or what's to come?

Tapas needs to re-prioritize what they really want for their platform as a website/app and as a brand. They absolutely need to find a PR specialist who can retrain them on how to engage with their community, because it's obvious after becoming so corporate these last few years that they've fallen out of practice.

And if they do re-prioritize and that idea of what they want Tapas to be is not something I'm comfortable with associating with? I'll definitely take advantage of the door. Honestly, depending on how staff responds to this, if they ever do (I understand that I'm not the most conventional person to have a discussion with lol) this is probably going to be the defining moment as to whether or not I continue to use this platform. I was fine with not getting rising statistics out of it (for any of you who've seen my recent thread regarding a personal sub count that's been practically locked in place for a record 4+ years, you know what I'm talking about lolol) but if I'm not getting joy out of it, that's when I draw the line.

And if you guys come to a similar decision, whether it be tomorrow, a month from now, or years from now, please don't ignore your freedom to do so.

That being said, we're also free to stand up and demand better because the majority of us make up this website as users who do Tapas a service of providing our work, in bulk, for free. Some may say that yes, they do a service by providing the platform ... but they're not the only platform out there. And unlike other platforms, Tapas seems to have made it their mission to give us less and less reason to continue posting here. At the moment, the giving/taking ratio is very skewed between the userbase and Tapas. I understand that Tapas wants to be able to provide options to creators to make a living off their work through things like the Ink Support System and Ad Revenue, which is supposed to separate them from other platforms like LINE, SmackJeeves, and ComicFury ... so why make it so hard for us to actually get visibility and hit those markers we need to hit to actually get paid out? I can't even remember the last time I was at the $25 benchmark required to pay out. It's been at least two years and I'm giving it a gracious estimate based off the top of my head, I'm fairly certain it's been far longer than that.

Don't form connections with corporations or let yourself be held down by some imaginary obligation to a relationship that doesn't exist. You can still cherish the memories that come with this place, but don't think for a second that you don't have a choice or that every decision you make is penultimate. Give yourself some credit for what you brought to the table, because if you hadn't, those memories wouldn't exist in the first place. Don't let Tapas take all the credit for them - if you hadn't made those memories here, not only would you not have noticed, but you would have made memories that were just as valuable - if not more so - elsewhere.

Explore your options. Do what's best for you and your work, because both you as an artist and your work, something only you could possibly create, deserves better.

And most importantly, be informed. Ask questions, and then ask them again and LOUDER when they aren't heard. Be patient for those answers when you have to be, but don't settle for ghosting or for plausible deniability (i.e. "we can't answer that question"). And for god's sakes, whatever decision you do make, please stick by it. Responses from staff are great, yes, because it's more than some companies will provide - but please, for the love of god and all that's holy, don't reward them for the bare minimum of responding, because that's all it's become at this point. That's like if your kid painted all over your walls, you yell at them, they respond "oh whoops i painted on the wall" and you go "OMG you're such an angel, i forgive you, don't worry about it!" I'm not saying don't ever move on from these issues or don't come to an understanding with Tapas, but don't forgive them just for responding. Forgive them when there's enough time for them to have taken action and stuck to those actions, including in their future decisions.

I mean jfc why do y'all think I'm so unapologetic towards Tapas at the moment, when years ago I would have stood up for them at every turn? Because after years of those mistakes stacking up, they've proven that they think rectifying issues they caused should be bare minimum for satisfaction. I don't want to just see them fix the issues they caused, I want to see them learn from them so that these issues don't happen again. And the fulcrum of their issues is sans communication, next to lack of transparency and honesty. The unannounced and buggy-to-hell/watered down/LINE Webtoon copypasta website updates and the lack of visibility towards smaller 'non mainstream' comics and the like are all just the tip of a much bigger iceberg.

Thank you, and I hope you're all safe and healthy in these times.

Yeah, all of those concerns are perfectly valid.

If I can put it simply, I don't think Tapas did a great job in choosing their investors. Maybe they didn't have much to choose from, seeing as how webcomics aren't exactly a booming economy with investors crawling over each other to get first in line. But it's very obvious that if their investors had a hand in this, they are extremely disconnected from what they're seeding their money into, to a very obvious extreme (to the point that it's almost concerning? Like y'know the decisions you're making could actually ruin you and lose your investments?) And that probably comes with the fact that again, webcomics aren't a booming economy. How many of Tapas' investors actually know what they're putting their money into?

Hell, I remember Michael telling the mod team (back when I was on it) a very funny story about him as the Editor in Chief explaining to a bunch of suited up investors what "Boy Love" was and why it was the upcoming trendy thing. Like just picture that lol These are the people making decisions for the company I know that obviously Michael had to do a lot of legwork to get them on the same page and convince them it would be a worthy investment, but maybe don't put those same people in charge if they had to be fully explained what they were putting their money into? God, people with expendable income can be so dumb.

Honestly, it all brings to mind a very strange - but I promise it make sense - comparison to one particular video game company - Hello Games, the small team that developed No Man's Sky.

Do you guys remember when No Man's Sky came out? Despite its delays, people were so excited for it. And then it flopped because it was obvious the developers had bitten off WAY more than they could chew, they didn't have any PR to keep them from saying stupid shit (the lead developer did most of the talking and it lead to a lot of miscommunication and things getting blown out of proportion because he's just not a public speaker or used to dealing with the media), and the game, as a result, was full of bugs, and only had a fraction of the features they had promised or the gamers had been lead to believe would be in the game thanks to the lead developer not knowing how to word things very carefully to an eager press ready to blow up headlines.

We've seen these fallouts time and time again (no pun intended, another good example is Fallout 76, which did NOT recover well from its mistakes btw and they keep making more of them). We expected No Man's Sky to fall to the wayside and we'd remember it as this horrible game that failed miserably.

But guess what happened?

The developers got back to work. They went silent. They stopped talking to the press. People assumed they had abandoned the game and they couldn't count on it ever being fixed.

And then, months later, a patch released.

All the major concerning bugs, fixed, with fixes for the smaller ones on the way. A handful of promised features were put in.

And all those updates were free to those who had already purchased the game. They didn't have to pay the company more money for the mistakes they had already made.

And every update since has been free. No DLC paywalls. No microtransactions. The game comes as it is with its improved patches, for the same price as it was upon release.

And now No Man's Sky is a legitimately great game.

Right now, Tapas is at a crossroads, where they're currently No Man's Sky upon its initial - failed - release, and they can either keep being like Hello Games and get their shit together, or they can become Bethesda: saying things like "we can't answer that question" or ghosting in a way that says "Well we know it's a problem, but we're not going to do anything about it". I want to see them do better by being Hello Games.

I can't perfectly make the comparison without rambling, so if you have the time, I highly suggest you check out the Internet Historian's videos on both Fallout 76 and No Man's Sky and just compare them. Yes, the videos are a bit longer, but they're absolutely worth a watch (especially if you're into gaming and, in Fallout 76's case, really hilarious roasting sessions lol). Hopefully, if you do take a look at them, you'll see the full reasoning as to why I've made the comparisons and why I know Tapas can do better.

As it currently stands, assuming much of this is investor based (which is painfully obvious), it's clear that Tapas just doesn't have a good relationship or aligned priorities with the people seeding them money. And as a result, it's being led astray by people who probably didn't even know what a webcomic was before Michael sat them down and explained it to them. It's a big assumption to make but can you really say you don't suspect the same, even by the slightest bit?

And yes, I'm worried about Michael. I'm worried about Yoon and all the devs who have been here from the start who are obviously under a lot of pressure to satisfy investors otherwise lose their jobs. Most of all, I'm worried about their passions being exploited and distorted into something unrecognizable. Because believe me, I can practically hear the reservations and uncertainty coming through in some of the dev's posts when they post. I can genuinely tell that many of them wish they still had the power to tell us things, and keep us updated, and actually discuss the platform's quality and future with us, but they're now obviously in a position now where that's no longer possible.

They bit off more than they could chew and they've lost sight of their destination along the way It's really, really discouraging to see.

But it's been years now. Maybe it hasn't been long enough, but I'd like to see Tapas soon be in a position where they can 'shop around' more for their investors and who ends up on their Board of Directors and as a result, get investors who actually know what they're putting their money into and how to get the most out of it in a way that's productive for them, the company, and its users. Because it's obvious the people that are there now haven't the slightest clue. Tapas may not have been around as long as some of the other corporate giants out there, but they're not a baby company anymore; they're growing up now and it's time they started putting on their big boy pants and flexing their own decision making lol

Yup, that's the hard part. Maybe it's 'too soon' but it's like what we're going through now with quarantining. People are gonna follow quarantine rules and then not see instant results - they're gonna see cases go up, in fact, as testing becomes more available and symptoms start to show, but it just means that we're actually identifying those cases now - and think "UGH QUARANTINING ISN'T WORKING." It is. Just not in the way that you think it is.

In Tapas' case, if they go silent, it's definitely gonna be "damned if you do, damned if you don't". Maybe they don't need to go DEAD silent, because I literally just highlighted all their communication problems above LOL but if appearing to be the bad guy for a while means they get their act together in the long run, I'd be content with that. Lord knows I'll probably still be here by then, despite all my complaining. But I know it's the public as a whole that's the concern. And making sure Tapas doesn't go under in the meantime.

But that's if they're even working on it. There's so much going on right now, it's hard to perceive what's in our future and in Tapas'. I just know that as it is right now, it's not working. They can't keep doing the same thing expecting it to eventually work out.

I'd like to think that if they're not already at a turning point, all this backlash whips them into one, because they desperately need it, for the platform, the community, and the staff's sake.

But at the same time, while I feel bad for the devs, I'm not going to start forgiving the decisions that have been made - and the complete lackthereof on the flipside - until concrete actions are put into place, even if it's not for a while. It might seem crass, but in my honest opinion, I can empathize with the devs and still hold Tapas' actions accountable. Just like how I can feel bad for someone but still have the expectation that they need to get their shit together if they want to continue a relationship. Because constantly forgiving and feeling sorry and not expecting better is how you end up with complacency and mistakes being repeated over and over and over again. It all goes back to what I mentioned above about our rights as users to decide whether or not its worth weathering the storm. Especially if that storm may never have a breaking point.

We'll see how the next few weeks go for sure

I do hope the silence means they're working on a fix and not because something bad is going on.
I still believe in tapas and I hope it will once again become the amazing place for comics it used to be.

It's a learning curve, companies that rely on their audiance need to interact with them. I think Tapas thought this layout change was amazing and we'd all love it, so they didn't discuss it with us in order to surprise us.
However, things that change drastically aren't always welcomed, and big things should be discussed beforehand.

But from here on things can only improve, I wish the staff all the best and please stay safe.

Can't we just go back to the previous version?

I really miss it and this version is really tedious to navigate on a daily basis. It lack a lot of things and its so bland. if it wasn't for the author that are still there I would have been gone at least a week ago.

I feel less and less that I'll be able to stay on tapas any longer.

That would be great.
As the good old quote says 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'

And yes, I know many people abandoned tapas. I did too, however I keep checking back to see if there are any updates. I keep my hopes up. Tapas used to be amazing and I hope it can become amazing once again.
Until then, I'll be on webtoons ^^

I do think it has already been ask if you look on the "first" top post of this very topic you'll see some of my answer. Rolling back have been asked from the very beginning. And I remember your message and its answer. But as some people said its been 3 week maybe it would be time to comment?

I've been the first I think to ask for the return of infinite scrolling. We've been told that "it will come", but when?

Even if I don't want to disrespect Tapas team, I feel like they are playing with us. They have answered our complaint 3 week ago and just after that they have started the waiting game to see when we will get tired of waiting for them doing something and finally abandon asking for things. Because they have all the card in hands. And us? We can't do anything. The only thing we can do is leave tapas for good. But they have all the traffic statistic they need and as long as their not a mass exodus of users (creator and reader) nothing will be done.

Well, from what I heard more and more users readers and creators alike are making a stand and leave until things get either back to what it was or the current layout fixed/improved.

It's not only the layout btw, the 24/h limit is gone (so the same popular comics hog the popular page 24/7) The same comics both free and premium get promoted very often. Hidden gems of comics/novels will stay hidden like this. And there's probably a lot more issues that makes it very hard for small/starting creators on tapas.

All we can do is wait and hope the staff will listen to us, and personally I hope that's what the silence means, so that the next time they answer us is with good news.

What was the 24hr limit?

It's Saturday, the day when I usually read comics/novels when I could not do it before in the week.

I can't bring me to do it.
Because last week was so disagreeable. No matter how good and immersive the works are, if the immersion is broken when opening the page, when changing page, when liking, when commenting etc..., it's not a nice experience.

I never liked Tapas reading experience, mostly because long form comics (my favorite) are making my computer freeze, but now I feel like I was nitpicking. These were problems I could work around. I can't work around getting constantly disconnected from what I read. I'm going to keep trying, because I'm not ready to abandon the works I'm reading, but at this point, I know it's not a case of 'need more time to adapt'.
No (forseeable) time will make Latin script read from right to left. I don't get why don't they fix AT LEAST these arrows? It's such a small change and would bring a huge improvement.

It has 71k subs, it's further down at this point, for which I'm glad (as weird as that may sound) but a few days ago I found it on the 7th row for free comics (I remember it cuz I discussed about it with someone on discord) so personally I just don't like this 24/h removal because comics like mine take up those spots even if it's not been updated in 2 months while a new comic gem is stuggling to climb up in those ranks.

Hmm...I would think the hate premium comics get will lessen now that free and premium content can be split, which was a good move. imo the advertisment is fine, sure there's a lot, but they don't advertise in the notifications often.
On the site you can now pretty much avoid all premium content by making your tapas bookmark this for example; https://tapas.io/comics?b=POPULAR&g=&f=F2R3

Yeah, that definitely helps! They've made strides with it but there are still things that need to be fixed, such as the 24/h removal.

That being said though, I'd like to point out that it's not solely "Premium" by the technical definition, despite my wording in places lol I'm also referring to 'mainstream' which can also include free to read comics. As I've mentioned before, Sarah's Scribbles, Rock & Riot, theodds1out, etc. are all very popular comics and are also free-to-read. But they've got plenty of subscribers and influence as it is (and in Rock & Riot's case, it hasn't updated in three years), so why do we see them getting promoted in every genre-based Trending tab on the landing pages for comics that are nowhere near those numbers? (in the case of those three comics, the Comedy genre specifically, which is one of the more competitive genres).

As someone else here stated once a while back, it feels very much like the website is going "Hey why waste your time reading this, look at THESE comics instead". If they're going to make a series landing Trending tab, make it varied and perhaps set it to the same metrics as the comic being read so that it continues to vary as the comic itself gains more subs or grows a bigger community. That way other comics in that same genre have a better chance of getting seen, and the comics that are already constantly dominating the top rows in the Popular section and the front page of the website don't get yet another avenue for promotion, and one so small, specific, and not even guaranteed to show up (if you have multiple series) that they really don't need it the way someone with a new series or fewer subs might.

And again, that's assuming the Trending tab even shows up. If someone has multiple series - something that's completely out of our control as creators who may be trying to get our work out there - then that avenue is gone. And as I mentioned in my big conspiracy post from a couple nights ago, the majority of free to read creators have multiple series. So this almost intentionally disenfranchises the smaller free to read comics that don't have the advantage of dominating the front page every single day even more.

So in addition to the Trending tab needing to not be so biased towards comics that are already getting that front page/Popular section exposure constantly (or were popular 5 years ago and have literally not updated since), they need to either make it accessible to everyone regardless of whether they have multiple series, or not at all. It just seems foolhardy to have it only appear for some people and not others depending on something so mundane as whether or not they have more than one series - and then when it does, it's the same shit you just saw 30 seconds ago on the front page or Popular section.

On another semi-related note, I know people are discouraged right now that they're not hearing back from Tapas at the moment, but let's please remember that it's Saturday. So we'll probably not hear anything official until Monday. I know it's hard because they've been largely silent even up until now regarding a lot of issues, but let's all hang in there And remember, whatever you decide to do for your future is your decision. Recognize it, own it, and learn from it, for better or for worse