Flawed vs. Unlikable Character

[dawgofdawgness]

Helloooo, it's your friendly neighbor Dawg!
So I'm having a lot of trouble writing characters (especially since they're the main focus of my story) and I specifically wanted to know how to write a flawed character who isn't unlikable or annoying.

What I know so far is that while unlikable characters can seem annoying/mean/etc. to the audience, a well written flawed character is only annoying/mean/etc. to the rest of the characters.
But.. How do you do that?

My current problem is that my MC Frances seems (to me, at least) a little TOO quixotic. And annoying. I want to start her off as insensitive/selfish so I can develop her later on, but I'm afraid that my readers might find her to be a little too much.

Sooo what are your guys' thoughts?

[TheThoughtfulBoxful]

The best way I think is to show both sides of the character via cause/effect.

Like with Frances, you made it pretty clear to the audience how much she wanted to be in the best jazz combo at her school, but instead ended up in the "leftovers" combo (cause). Her jerky behavior (effect) to the other characters is understandable to the readers because of that initial reveal of What Frances Wants, or the cause.

as long as you periodically remind te readers of your character's initial cause, either through dialogue or scenes that are exclusive to your MC and the audience, their (the character's) behavior will most likely be seen as justified.

[Samuraiflame]

Yup, I agree with what TheThoughtfulBoxful said. But honestly, I wouldn't try too hard to make a character likable, even to what you consider a 'general audience'. People tend to like different characters, and some people (like myself) are more empathetic to villains and jerks while others will hate them regardless of how justified they are in their attitude.

It also helps to show moments where they aren't just being unlikable or rude, just to help round them out from being labeled a jerk 24/7. Even grouches can and should have good days.

[Rhonder]

Hmmm that's kinda tricky. I guess the first obvious thing is that it's not necessarily bad to write a character whose flaws make them unlikable to the reader, especially since that can potentially set them up for a greater impact upon their development actually happening/resolving.

However, more to the actual question asked, I guess when I think about characters who are obnoxious/unlikeable, it's when they're kind of overbearing about flaws (or just character traits/personalities in general, of which flaws are naturally a part of) and you get it shoved in your face all the time. Like, if a character is all "Woe is me, whatever thing happened and I'm so inferior and etc. etc." in like every scene they appear in. It kind of makes you want to slap them and tell them to get over it... sometimes other characters actually do that xD Another is when a character is over the top douche-bag-y just all the time, and never show any other sides to themselves.

I guess that's kind of the key: try to make the character multifaceted and not just 1-Dimensional. Their flaw(s) can (and probably should) be an important part of themselves, but ideally they have positive traits too, or just other traits in general. Different people will feel different ways about the character, but you can at least be satisfied that you wrote them objectively good, or interesting.

[MGComics]

There are flaws and flaws, sometimes some flaws are actually more attractive.

Someone racist is not atractive at all to general society, for example, it's too big of a flaw. But a character stealing is quite accepted, even though it's also bad! In all action movies almost, the characters steal cars and clothes because they're running!

So #1- Give a reason why that character is flawed, so it becomes a bit more justified. Many characters are hated at the beginning and then you find out the reason and people usually end up loving them. Make sure it's a good reason, though or at least in proportion. Maybe that character never received love, etc.

#2- Qualities that make it likable - Maybe your character is super flawed but has a sweet side to him/her. Like the typical brother who is horrible to his brother, but does stand by him in front of bullies. Or the weird kid in school that is disgusting and mean to kids, but actually goes saving animals in need and being mean is just his way of keeping people away from his shyness.

#3 Flaws that are a escape route? - Dr House is one very flawed character (and some people can't stand him because of some seasons but still). But people like him because he was too "honest", though sometimes too cynical. The audience resonated to the honesty part because it's something they want to do but they usually don't dare to do it themselves. So they can kinda live the character's experience instead of ruining their own life themselves. I think this also happened with Breaking Bad

#4 Overcoming some of those flaws- Well, the character shouldn't change too much because it's needed to be consistent. But for character development he/she should ideally learn something (or become worse, if that's the story). That makes it even more interesting, because we see a change. Or maybe opportunities to change, and that person can't/decides not to take them. And we feel like "agh! If only ..." and feel emotionally connected to what we want the character to do.

Many people in Breaking Bad wanted Walter to ...be meaner to his wife when the writers wanted the audience to hate her, even though we knew she was usually right or better at least than her husband. Which was fascinating because people's values: sexism, respect, etc. was challenged by seeing those characters in the screen. There are essays about it on YouTube, maybe you can find some.

Hope this helps in some way >.<

[DiegoPalacios]

There are many ways to make a character that is being rude/jerk/whatever likable.

In your case you said Frances will develop into a better person, so this growth will help. The important point is to keep what makes her endearing in the first place

But what to do in the meantime?, here are some ideas.

1-Humor: A character that is rude/jerk or whatever can become likable to the audience just because is hillarious. Frances is quite entertaining with her excitable personality and impulsive behavior, so you are in a good way there.

2-Punishing the jerk behavior: If your character is affected by karma or punished by other characters if she crosses a line, she becomes more tolerable. (you are in a good way in this too)

3- Draw a line in what your MC will and will not do. Is important to know what kind of behavior is being too much considering this character. For example, in the case of Frances, i think breaking someone`s instrument on purpose would be going too far for her, because she has a strong passion for music and deeply understand how valuable and meaningfull is an instrument for a musician.

4-Show some virtues for the character. Everyone has virtues and flaws. (make sure those virtues are shown subtly and gradually). For example, if Frances is more skilled in music than her companions, she can do something about it to make the team improve. (even if is just because she is frustrated about noobs) That personal investment could gradually become a genuine care about the beginner combo....or maybe not (maybe her hate for Anton will be uncondicional)

The key is to know which way or ways works better for your character. Some of this advice may work for Frances while some doesn`t. You have a solid characterization for your characters, so you can figure it out.

Enjoying Leftovers so far and hope this helps!

[Penni]

I really can't add anymore than what's been said! I think you got some solid advice here

[AmysGames]

It's a fair question—I've felt the same way about my own main character, Sanori, given that she tends to be incredibly antisocial, lol.

But yeah, I'd say the best way to make a flawed character likable is to make them relatable. Show their reasons for their flawed behavior. Show the consequences of their flaws, and how it affects them. Show moments when perhaps they wish they didn't have those flaws, and/or try to overcome them. Stuff like that. (And if all else fails, snarky humor tends to go over well. )

I also agree with @Samuraiflame though in that some people may not ever like a rude character no matter how many good qualities you give them. In which case, I'd say try not to worry about it too much—you can't please everyone, after all. I think the most important thing is that YOU are happy with your own character.

[Zaboem]

Hmm, I'll lay out some characters on a line ranging from Perfect to Perfectly Terrible.

At the extreme end on the Perfect side, you have Mary Sue characters who are unbeatable and possess no flaws. Mary Sues can be fun, but they are often criticized and considered amateurish in 2018.

Just shy of Perfect, we have Shakespearean tragic heroes. Shakespearean wrote tragic main characters in a lot of his plays. A tragic hero is a perfect dudes except for one very singular character flaw, and that flaw ultimately leads to his downfall. Othello was very near a Mary Sue except for his insane jealousy which ended up costing him everything. Tragic heroes can be less well liked than anyone else on the line if their flaws are particularly offensive.

Towards the middle, we have characters who multiple flaws because they are complex characters. They can be likable or not. A particular example which my wife was discussing earlier is Leslie Knope from Parks and Recreation who goes through the show making terrible decisions and generally being a manic career-obsessed insufferable crazy, but she was one of the most beloved characters on tv at the time. The character of Leslie had very redeeming traits like her care for others, her resilence, her high energy (which is nice is small doses of exposure), and her pride. It's a balance which struck very well in her case.

Then at the far end, we have characters who are just walking piles of bad traits. Characters like Rick Sanchez, Dogbert, and Mister Burns have basically no redeeming traits among the lot of them. Yet, these characters can be very popular. What is the common characteristic? Humor. They are the funniest characters even among casts of other funny characters. Audiences are invited to laugh at their flaws, not despite those flaws.

In Pride and Prejudice, I enjoyed Mister Bennet's quipping so much, I almost missed the fact that the is actually a lousy father and husband.

Likeable characters can appear at any point of this spectrum. I'm not saying that character flaws aren't a factor. Maybe there isn't magical formula. Maybe one just has to throw characters against the wall and see which stick.

[Zaboem]

Oh yeah, since we are talking about applying this all to comics, character design is a factor. Certain colors and shapes resonate better with audiences. For some reason, circles work. Charlie Brown is called a block head, but he's actually a big circle on a small body, and circles convey a pleasing energetic personality. Some of the artists here can speak to this with more knowledge than I could explain it.

[indigodrawing]

I think one good way of telling one from the other is whether or not the character in question shoes any kind of concern for something that doesn't affect him/her directly.

Compare early Homer Simpson. He was selfish, immature, greedy, lazy, dim-witted, opinionated, domineering etc, but he also showed genuine compassion from time to time, he sometimes made unexpected sacrifices for the sake of his family (like giving up a chance to ride on a blimp so that he could do something to make Lisa happy instead), and he showed the occasional hidden depth. He was a very flawed character, but he was still a character you could empathise with and relate to.

Contrast current Homer Simpson. He's selfish, immature, greedy, lazy, dim-witted, opinionated, domineering etc, but... um.... nope, got nothing. Everything that made the character an actual relateable character has been stripped away leaving nothing behind except for an archetype and a pile of ever increasingly obnoxious flaws. What's more he now gets people killed and doesn't seem to care (That one-shot character who he drove nuts and electrocuted himself and Maud Flanders). There's nothing likeable about him anymore.

For a character to be flawed but relateable they need to not be defined by their flaws. They need to have them, sure, but they also need virtues to balance it out. They need conflict to make them seem like they're in a difficult situation, they need to be presented with situations where they can do the easy thing or the right thing, and tend to be more likely to do the right thing, no matter how unhappy about it they are.

[amortelito]

I kind of learned that people are willing to forgive dick behavior if the character is:
a) funny therefore they can laugh with the behavior and even encourage it.
b) it is very clearly stated why is the character such a dick...
c) the mean behavior is relatable to the audience, "Omg I which I could get away with doing that in real life."

And overall I think It really does help add a little of vulnerability to be sure the character doesn't come across as a sociopath. XD

[faighta]

oh darling! I actually love Frances - and her dynamic with her roommate is just too perfect! (and BOI the roommate was mean throwing her to the street during her weeping)

She's does have all of those flaws but one would expect (given the tone of your comic) that she will grow up eventually - so I could tell your intentions of developing her later on!

I think what's important when showing a flawed character is making sure there is more that meets the eye - so by showing just a little bit of a redeeming trait in a character it would help the reader to sympathize with it!

Everybody probably gave you better advice! but I can say I like Frances - Maybe I am a weirdo...

[beta1042]

I do think it depends on the flaws like someone else said. Some flaws you just aren't going to overcome easily.

Some of this has already been said, but
1)comedy - people will immediately forgive a lot if the character is funny about their flaws(Have you read/seen Nozaki kun?), And if a character can laugh with you about the ridiculousness of some of their actions.

2)being relatable - other people have commented on this but I wanted to add: On the flip side, keep in mind that we all probably know someone annoying in life and have at some point been the victim of their annoying shenanigans. Try to keep in mind the things that have annoyed you to no end and avoid having your character do too much of that.

3)giving reasons for their actions. We're way more likely to forgive a jerk if we understand their actions.

4)Can the character redeem themselves if they've gone too far? I think it's ok to have moments where the character is too much, but what is the aftermath of this? Are they willing to acknowledge their own flaws and do anything to rectify the situation? Just don't over do this because no one wants to see a character that always has to apologize and never learns to fix themselves.

5)For every few flawed traits give them some good traits. No one is ever all good or all bad, so make sure there are good qualities that shine through that balance the character out, or make it worth it to tolerate some of their annoyances.

6) And lastly, attractive people are waaaaay more likely to get away with being dicks, just saying, it doesn't hurt if the physical appearance of your character is hot, or adorably cute(this is I think playing a big factor with Frances for me cause she's coming off adorable rather than annoying to me), or just really interesting/unique looking.

[Rhombik]

I think a lot of people have already covered what I would say so I'll just add that I've read a lot of stuff where people throw in a tragic backstory to make a flawed character more likeable. I think this is lazy writing and can actually work against the character. I think it's better to see gradual, logical changes over time and see motivations revealed slowly.

[shazzbaa]

I actually kinda disagree with the idea that we need to see where a character's Bad Behaviour "comes from" or "justify" it. Like, that's a thing you can do!! It's not a bad way to work!! but the idea that "we will find this character annoying UNLESS we can see that she's only like this because when she was a child she was neglected by her parents" rings false in all directions to me. If you have a character who feels real to us, then that character can be one we care about even while knowing that she's doing bad things that are completely unjustifiable. If you have a character who feels shallow and flat, adding sympathetic backstory and justifiable reasons for their actions isn't going to make them likeable.

Der-shing Helmer had my favourite thoughts on this:

The most popular character in my comic is a huge jerk, and while he has a fair amount of reason to be angsty, most of his problems are self-created. Why does he shut people out? Because he's afraid to trust people, afraid of being obligated to others. Does he have a good reason for that? How did he come to be that way? I don't think those things necessarily matter.

[Rhombik]

I actually kinda disagree with the idea that we need to see where a character's Bad Behaviour "comes from" or "justify" it.

Concur.

The whole time I was writing my post I was thinking about Doctor Cox from Scrubs. The whole way through the programme, they don't go into his backstory that much. And yet we don't mind that he's narcissistic, self-involved, arrogant and antagonistic or that he's so unapologetic about it. I think part of this is that we can what drives him and the logic behind his decisions but also that we do see him make mistakes and gradually change.

Frankly he was the only character they didn't completely ruin.

It also hit me that it's kind of best when things are a little uneven. Sometimes flawed characters can be rewarded even though they haven't earned it or still not get what they want even though they've stopped making the same mistakes. When you watch somebody try and fail then watch how they react, it can actually make you root for them more.

[beta1042]

Oh when I said justify I didn't mean like with a tragic past or anything. I mean there should be reasons for doing the actions you do. LIke little reasons. For example, maybe they're asking a lot of questions because they get nervous when talking to a crush, or maybe someone is obnoxiously penny pinching because they're saving up for some sweet gift for another character, or maybe they say this one rude thing all the time because someone told them once it made them sound cool.

[dawgofdawgness]

Wooh! Sorry for the late reply, this was a lot to read. Thanks for all the advice! ^_^ these are super helpful.
I think I have a better idea on how to write my characters now. Hope this thread comes in handy for others with the same problem as me

[Stardust-clearwater]

I don't believe I've seen this mentioned but another thing you can do is have traits that may not necessarily be flaws but are grating none the less or flaws that turn out to be virtues in certain circumstances.

Like someone who is really nosy and in everyone's business. Someone like that would be a real pain to live or work with but when your neighbor with a gun is having a psychotic break they would be the first person to know and warn people.

Take Imelda from the movie Coco. She's extremely determined and willful. This probably saved her family in the long run but it means shes incredibly stubborn and difficult when she doesn't see eye to eye with someone.