Ink + Watercolor: What goes first?

[franzvanderlinde]

I am going back and forth on the best order here. For those using traditional methods, do you ink first and then paint later? Doesn't that leave you with less black inks? I tend to do the other way around, but it's also a bit annoying because sometimes is hard to see the pencil lines.

[surenlicious]

Though I started painting over pencil and add the ink work later, now I start with my inks first. And no, if you use quality ink it ain't gonna leave you with less ink unless you use gouache. But depending on what you intend, you can always give it a little love later.

[nostalgicroxas]

Is the ink waterproof or water activated/water soluable? Even a waterproof ink when saturated with a lot of water, like the process of watercoloring, can still make it stain and bleed. So always test!

[WhiskeyMadDog]

I always do ink first before watercolor.
I highly recommend the Sakura micron pens as they are waterproof, with crisp black lines. They also last a long time.
Also, J. Herbin encre (French ink) is a good brand for ink too. But it's water soluble, so apply it last.
Both products have good crisp lines and come in many colors. I know this isn't a product recommendation thread, but I just thought I'd help you because these are the inks I use a lot when I do watercolor.

Good luck!

[franzvanderlinde]

Even with Sakura pens, If the watercolor goes over it, the black fades a bit (it is not solved or leaked, just has a layer of watercolor over it). It is the case when the lines are part of the texture or volume of an area. I always have to go ink over again, which I would like not to. Perhaps I use a lot of color in my watercolors? Or darker colors affect it more?

[WhiskeyMadDog]

Yeah same here.
What I've noticed is that darker colors tend to affect the ink more.
I think all pens have their faults and you just have to keep testing until you find a pen that speaks to you.

[phoenixrenaissance]

I ink last. It does leave the lines nice and bright. Though yeah, trying to see the pencil lines under the paints can be a struggle.
Oh, and I do brush inking with speedball super black ink. I have noticed my watercolors wash it out a little if I ink first.

[franzvanderlinde]

To get the most quality output I have been pre-inking some details and background with sakura small pen, then I ink with the brush to give the final look, for far away BG, I just leave it at that really. I just would like to ink on paper directly to get the most fun and can focus on my inking alone before adding colors, so I will try the next page like that and see how much I have to redo later.

[rajillustration]

I tend to ink last because the inks I like to use are a little water soluble so...otherwise it'd bleed.

[WhiskeyMadDog]

Hi there.
I know this thread is very old but today, I have found an ink that will solve your problem.
It's called Higgins calligraphy ink and it is a waterproof ink that you use in a fountain pen. What's cool about it is that it dries very quickly and it is waterproof so you can paint over it. The best part of this ink is that it does not lose its luster when painted over and the blackness does not fade unlike Sakura pens. I am using it right now and it's super awesome! I hope this helps you and that you had a great day. ^^

[FritzC]

Oh this thread is old but as a watercolour comic artist I wanted to bud in... I usully do ink with waterproof fine liners and then add watercolour, then colour correct it afterwards digitally to make the black lines darker again if the watercolour dilutes it. Example:

[franzvanderlinde]

I tried it out to do it like some mentioned, it takes more time but the result seems much better. I am sold on using this technique now:
- Initial inking with a brush with India Ink (waterproof) and Sakura pens for smaller details and BGs.
- Watercolors
- Full black areas and retouching on important elements that may have been covered by watercolor.

Here is the second page I drew like that (will post it in a few weeks):

[franzvanderlinde]

Thanks! I am using Speedball India Ink and it holds quite well too. It's almost over so I will try to find this one to compare.