Should I give up posting novels to Tapas?

ratscout 2021-01-29 08:36:26 UTC #10

You know, I think if something is making you truly miserable, it's definitely okay to stop. I've had some projects that I didn't finish--and even now just talking about them makes me feel just the slightest achey inside--but I've sort of come to realize as an old woman that it's okay to stop working on things that don't make you happy. It hurts to let them go, but you sort of realize you can take ideas from them and incorporate them into a tighter, finer story. I have to say, I am definitely happy I discontinued my older stories because I have done just that: Crafted them into other stories that I'm truly in love with and wouldn't give up on for the world. The reason I start out by saying this is because it seems like you're no longer getting enjoyment out of your story, so I think it might be time to reassess what you do with it.

Getting that out of the way, I have to suggest doing read-for-reads (or B for reach). Read-for-reads are FANTASTIC because they often reveal the people on this site who are really, truly, as passionate about writing as you are, because they are willing to spend a little piece of their day reading your story so that you will read theirs, too. I've met a lot of people on those threads who are supportive, helpful, and great readers. Not only that, but it feels so good to just have people who consistently read your story, and the easiest way to find those people is through read-for-reads. Yes, it's scary putting yourself out there, but most people really are just trying to help when they give you critiques on this site, and if you ever get a mean one, just admit what you know to be true: the person who gives you a mean critique sucks and move on with your life. XD Will this method necessarily net you millions of readers? No. Will it net you some? Yes. I think what most people have to realize is that, if you want to do writing as a career, you have to treat it as a job. Therefore, you need to put as much work into it as you would a job. At any rate, even just having one person reading your work makes you that much more excited about writing it.

KJWhitten 2021-01-29 17:04:05 UTC #11

Then your heart is in the wrong place if you are more concerned about building an audience and popularity than creating a comic or novel that you enjoy yourself. Popularity should be a secondary concern in my opinion.

But if you feel drained from the grind, then taking a hiatus for some time may be good. I wouldn't quit making novels unless, in your opinion, you will feel happier by stopping.

DokiDokiTsuna 2021-01-29 17:05:44 UTC #12

So...you read all the way to the end of that post, but neglected to read the first few lines where it clearly states:

lunagraves714 2021-01-29 17:13:48 UTC #13

Why is there always an assumption that we “don’t have passion” or are chasing “popularity“ if we feel like quitting some days...? Like come on, putting yourself out there in an online community is hard enough without that kind of judgement.

KJWhitten 2021-01-29 17:34:47 UTC #14

I was just responding to what you said to me specifically.

But I suppose you should ask yourself about how you feel about the Tapas audience and if they are right for your content. I've seen novels do surprisingly well on Tapas while others not so much. So idk its up to you.

therosesword 2021-01-29 18:06:51 UTC #15

It's been my experience in life that when someone starts talking about quitting something (unless it's smoking or something like that) they have already made up their mind and are looking for someone to say the one thing that assures them it's the right decision.

No one can make that decision for you. You've already made it, you're looking for validation. That's a tad bit unfair to people. Understandable, as it is a big decision, but ultimately it is yours and yours alone.

Best of luck.

DokiDokiTsuna 2021-01-29 18:13:45 UTC #16

...To be honest, although my mind was mostly made up, what I was looking for was a reason that I should not give up that I maybe hadn't thought of. So, close, but no cigar.

In any case, the decision has already been made, so this is all pretty much just theater at this point. ^^; You guys can talk about whatever, I guess, but if you're looking to respond to the OP, just bear that in mind.

milejdyvan 2021-01-29 19:30:05 UTC #17

So here's my take and I know you already made your mind (based on your latest response) but I didn't have tíme to respond before.

One thing that somewhat bothers me about your perspective is the idea that "others don't have to write that well to get reads". That is a very false statement if I may say. Although you may feel like something is mainstream or not unique enough does not mean that the writer didn't put a heck ton of effort into it. If something becomes popular, there IS something there that brings people to read it. Demeaning that and saying that the writers are not good at writing is just diminishing what they are good at.

Yes, popular does not equal good always, but good is subject to opinion. And as a writer, you have to understand the mentality of a reader. The truth is that a basic reader does not care if the writing isn't top notch, this is stuff that critics and other writers notice. A reader just wants to have a good time. I would know this as when I was an avid reader on various sites, I didn't care for typos or wouldn't quit just because the grammar was bad. I was a teenager. Who cared at that point. It was the story and the ideas that had to keep me hooked.

Saying this, should you quit? Well that is up to you. In my opinion, if there is something holding you on this app, then it might be bad for you to leave but I wouldn't know what your situation is. Does your story/writing fit the demographic on here? Again, that is something that you need to decide. If you want to continue on Tapas, then it's perhaps good to play by the rules. Do you want readers but not getting any? Then promote your story. Sorry if it sounds mean but it sounds like you're excusing your own laziness to promote. It's fun, and it's cool to find unique ways to do so. I personally have been pretty bored of the tapas forums recently so I switched to Twitter and so far it's been a much more fruitful experience. Again, it's different for everyone.

We all start at the bottom and from there it's just about the drill. If you want to quit, go for it. I went through the same thing when I escaped the hell hole of an app called wattpad, and migrated to the Chad Tapas app. In my opinion, it is superior, but also fits my story better as I've been lucky enough to get a readership in a MUCH smaller time frame than wattpad. I do consider wattpad as a learning process though since I tried to make my writing as good as possible and found readers there too. It was only when I was sure it was okay enough to post somewhere else that I did so. In that sense you could consider this same thing for tapas if you feel like there is a better option for you. Nothing necessarily wrong about that.

Again, my only issue is with how you compare it to the others. Not saying you can't compare, that IS the point of a competitive app, but once you start diminishing others' success is when I feel like there is a line crossed. Leave if it's bad for your mental state, but don't make it the fault of others' good time.

Ordinaryaverageguy 2021-01-29 19:38:11 UTC #18

I think I feel you. Sometimes the disappointment in visible success at the thing you love doing feels like too much & breeds doubt.
But, you're only talking of discontinuing use of one platform for your work. The writing's done! It seems akin to having your hooks baited & ready to go fishing. Seems a small thing to go ahead & put your lines into the water on this side of the boat as well as the other side.
Sorry if I've misunderstood your position.

TedGravesArt 2021-01-29 20:25:44 UTC #19

I don't envy novel writers. Getting people to read a comic is hard enough, getting people to read a novel is about a billion times harder.
I post on several comic sites, and compared to all of those other sites, Tapas does a terrible job at pushing views toward new content. I can't stress enough how truly awful their site is at propping up small creators. It's not set up for that. I got far FAR less views on Tapas until I started advertising on here, and even then it's hard. I know it feels yucky, but as a creator I just think you've gotta get used to it. No one will read your stories if they don't know about them. There are 7.6+ billion people on this planet, and mathematically speaking, I guarantee thousands of those people are rabid fans of your stories, they just don't know it. They can't, unless you find a way to put your books in front of them.
Sounds like you've already made up your mind about leaving Tapas, and yeah I get it. Your logic checks out. Not sure why you're not just passively posting all of your books up here though, why take them down?

Truth. There are some days where I sit down at my tablet feeling like I want to give up and stop, but I don't want to let my (few) readers down. I want to keep telling the story that they're invested in, for them, and for me.

YaoiParadise 2021-01-29 20:48:45 UTC #20

I think a lot of people forget that while Tapas is a comic/novel app, there is a very high social aspect to it as well, and you have to consider the audience if you want to succeed.

If you're so worried about readers, you have to put work into getting them. They're not just going to fall into your lap (unless you get really, really lucky). Making yourself appealing as an author is important in the webnovel world as an indie creator.

Checking your profile, it also looks like all of your works are short. It's important to keep in mind that Tapas (and its audience) is geared toward SERIAL works. Things that update regularly over a long period of time. Imo it's partially due to the fact that regular updates constantly push you back up to the top of the list when people are idly looking for new stories. Hence why when looking for submissions for premium works, Tapas puts an emphasis on considered works being 80k words are longer.

That considered you might be right in not posting to Tapas (especially since your attitude here is putting down other writers who have probably put in a lot of work to get the views/subscribers they have even if you consider them subpar writers)! Different platforms work for different people. It looks like you've already made up your mind looking back at your post, and that's probably for the best! Gaining popularity on Tapas takes a lot of work, advertising and socializing included.

TedGravesArt 2021-01-29 22:27:26 UTC #22

12- Unhelpful cynicism

SleepingPoppy 2021-01-29 22:28:30 UTC #23

i think it's awesome you found somewhere your work is better received. It doesn't really matter where anyone posts their work. If it works for you, it works.

As far as a reason to stay, it doesn't hurt to have a couple mirror sites. having tapas as a backup instead of main might take some of the sting out of the numbers. Then if things work out better later, hurray? Especially if you're still planning on hosting comics here. If you build an audience for one, there might be some bleed over from people that like your work.

I feel like it's way harder to discover novels that hit ones buttons, than it is comics. It's understandable even if someone's a really capable writer, it can be discouraging.

DasIstWunderblyat 2021-01-29 22:34:31 UTC #24

Is that fall on "Negativity bullshit" or not?

I deeply apologize

Rhonder 2021-01-29 22:59:38 UTC #25

cliffnotes thoughts:

re- it's silly to try and make someone feel bad for taking steps in their creative journey towards creating something that performs well Different people have different goals and they're mostly all viable. The steps to those goals aren't always the same. Just because being super dedicated to a particular platform or story aligns well with one person's goals doesn't mean that it'll be the same for everyone~

re- I feel like mirrored platforms are generally beneficial tho. I don't claim to know Tapas's novel interface very well but if it requires little effort to format scheduled updates and the novel is already complete, I would personally just schedule them all and walk away if the dashboard was stressing me out. If you do decide to do more novels at a later date on this site, whatever scraps of readers you can passively pick up will be valuable, otherwise no loss. Include a link in the author's note to make sure people know where else to find you tho xD

If it is a hassle tho I do absolutely understand not wanting to spend the time. I only continued to crosspost my first comic to Webtoons, for example, because it required very little effort to do so. It didn't do well there but the process was worth in my case for the reach I was able to get- those folks are all people that will see my "hey I have a new series now, check it out!" post next month

sevenstarsofeightIam 2021-01-29 23:42:45 UTC #26

All of us come to a platform like Tapas for a sense of connection, camaraderie, and support. That we show up at all speaks of our inherent worth and value. I have wanted to be a writer since the early sixties. I have spent my years undiscovered, unconnected.

But, I have in no way failed. I continue to write. My first completed work is on Amazon and now Kindle -- albeit on some back shelf where no one looks. I have books on Issuu.com. (This is me shrugging.) I see myself as a sputtering candle pressed on every side by darkness. I must say, I shine as much for myself as anyone else.

I hope you stay on and persevere. Before you make a decision to quit, do an internet search: read the story of the man who invented the ballpoint pen. I'm crossing my fingers for you.

domisotto 2021-01-29 23:56:25 UTC #27

Try it, but I gotta warn you, when something like that fails, it sucks more than failing with a niche story.

I’ve just written a YA, werewolf BL. Turns out, I don’t really connect with the YA, werewolf, BL audience.

Tapas audience is not easy win, but it gives you a fair shake. They are not here for anything sophisticated, they are here for a guy who found a bullied guy hang by his underwear in a door during a frat party. Speculative genre, including fairy tales, doesn’t do well online in comparison to BL here or high school romance, on Royal Road it’s lit novel and I reincarnated as a slave girl izekai.

The question is, do you love romance or I-reincarnated or bullied boy BL to write one with a song in your heart? Because if you do it while holding your nose, they will know.

Popularity is not an easy game to win, but making them love something you do takes a hell a lotta of a talent, and on the net it often won’t work. It’s ideal if you just happen to love the popular thing.

I think we all have to be ready for things not going perfect.

DokiDokiTsuna 2021-01-30 00:59:58 UTC #28

I feel like maybe I should respond to this...I hope no one feels offended or called out by what I said; that wasn't my intention.

I was just being honest. =/ No one's writing is perfect, and some authors clearly have more to work on than others. You can put a lot of effort and care into something and still not be good at it...yet.

All I was saying was that if you can still attract a decent amount of subs despite having really rough writing, then clearly skill isn't that much of a priority on this site. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, tbh.

It did make me sad, because I invest a lot of time and effort into polishing my writing and learning new ways to make it better, and it's a little frustrating to find out that it counts for f*ck all...but in the end, it also meant that it wouldn't be worth my time to blame my problems on my skill level, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯

skyfarron 2021-01-30 01:59:44 UTC #29

Just post your stuff expecting literally nothing back to whatever platforms are easy to post on, and if they eventually get attention it'll be a surprise. Make sure to have auto-posts programmed to keep your update frequency to at least once a week or so.

Creativity is a hobby, unless you're working for the big dogs - then you're making propaganda. That's why it pays. Big Art doesn't really care about the individual vision of an artist, or the human experience - they care about what makes them money.

Lots of big Hollywood productions are covert advertising for things like cars, soft drinks, lifestyles, and franchises themselves. Marvel movies are ads for Marvel comics and so on. Each promising to add value to your life in exchange for the value spent, by making you a part of their consumer group.

In my case, I'm expecting very little from my current work, and am focusing strictly on making myself happy. I have a few followers, which makes me happy to see, but the high wears off quick and before you know it, if you aren't careful you'll take them for granted in search of a bigger crowd. I had 200+ subscribers on a comic on Webtoons and deleted it because it didn't feel right for ME, even though it was working for everyone else.

Don't aim to 'make it big', aim to make it small. That's better than nothing. Then turn your small reward into a medium project, and so on. Work your way up the ladder, on your own terms.

If you want crowdfunding or sponsorship, ask yourself, "how am I adding value to their lives in exchange for what they're giving me?" If you're asking for money for the basic act of having created art, that's not going to work - those are the things we share with our family and friends for free, usually while they roll their eyes cause they don't really get it.

Speaking from over a decade of experience publishing online.

domisotto 2021-01-30 02:17:21 UTC #30

There is the golden middle of skill online that works for the mass reader. The completely broken stuff will just confuse everyone, and too much like a published book also will, because a lot of readers who read online have low exposure to books. They might have read a few popular YA titles or just watched anime or read lite novels or cell phone stuff.

It leaves the mid-level writers high and dry, as they can’t break out into trad publishing, but are considered too boring for the online mass reader. Basically,
shaving off complexity both plot-wise and stylistically, and writing specifically for online is, maybe, the goal. It has to be easy to read first and foremost and it has to have a high interest simple plot and almost melodramatic emotions.