Writing vs Art: it's not a contest

[SleepingPoppy]

You're assuming no one does that? 90% of the writers who post asking for collabs have no examples of their writing. It's not actually true that the well thought out collabs aren't read and considered, but that vast majority of people here are already working part or full time, are students, and are working on a personal project. Most of us literally don't have the ability to take on a free project for someone else.

edit: Maybe 80% have nothing, 10% have a script or part of a script, and maybe 10% are actual writers with completed or in progress work one can look at to guage ability and interest.

[punkarsenic]

EDIT: removing the crud

summary of their comment: why do artists asking for writers get more responses than the other way round?

beyond supply and demand, this is because most writers come to the forums looking to employ / commission an artist, and most artists come looking to be employed / commissioned*. the writer wants you to draw their idea. the artist wants to draw your idea. imagine if you had two stands, at one the guy called out 'give me free icecream!' and at the other, the guy called out 'FREE ICECREAM!' who's gonna be more popular?

*this isnt always the case, but usually calls for equal collaboration dont get the silent treatment that unsolicited calls for free / spec work do.

You know, that writer you couldn't be bothered to give the time of day could have been working on that project for well over a year (who knows), and you would turn him/her down in a mere instant? That's messed up.

if you cant afford to pay someone to make your Thing, you dont deserve to make your Thing. whatever you put into it prior to the make is irrelevant.

Who knows, it could have been the next big thing, but you couldn't be bothered because, "Oh, I can't be taking risks on gambles. I need something concrete. Something to sustain myself."

that is called spec work. making someones comic for free because they COULD get big, thats extremely-unlikely-to-be-fruitful spec work. you should never, under any circumstances, be you an artist, a writer, or an accountant, do spec work.

you should listen to this, itll be enlightening to you:

Episode 45 - Spec Work

[Jenny-Toons]

You could be the next Steven King and this kind of attitude still makes you a jerk.

Basically this. And like...ideas don't exist in a personal bubble. Someone out there can and will make the exact same idea, with the exact same story (or similar) and guess what -- they're not an asshole.

Like -- don't assume you have such a big, grand idea that people will overlook your attitude. Someone who's more chill and reasonable can easily take that idea and make it better. And even if it's not better, more people will gradually flock to that reasonable person than someone who's got an attitude problem.

[turtleme]

Yes people do that, but there are also a lot of writers that saying something like "I have this great idea but I can't tell you unless you're x-amount qualified and are super interested in it based on the three sentence brief I whipped up before I can show you my holy grail of a script."

Those same writers then complain about how everyone is ignoring them and being an "ass".

I've been on this forums for a few years now and I'm confident in saying that every writer who has pitched his/her idea in a professional manner (with previous experience, well-thought ideas, scripts uploaded and ready in a shareable document) have been met with professional treatment and interest.

On the flip side, writers who pitch like it's just a hobby or something on the side, artists treat it as such.

[UrMom]

Edit: Yo -- just a heads up. I'm reading through their posts, and they may or may not be a troll.

I'm with you on thinking this person may be a troll, their posts are too soap opera hammy not to be.

Unless they're a child/teenager, it's hard to tell the difference sometimes.

[SleepingPoppy]

I've been assuming that regardless. There's no reason to take them seriously based on their approach.

[Mari]

I feel like a lot of this butthurt could be erased if people who are looking for artists for their story ideas would get that if you want someone to draw out a story you wrote and want the art to your exact specifications, that's comission work. It's not really a collab. People who do collabs for free / future profits usually do them because they're both invested in the art/story. So if you want someone to do the art for free, you should be open for the artist to be involved in the writing / plot as well, and not come with a finished script....Atleast, that's how I feel about it. All the collabs I've been apart of have been labours of love with another person

[joannekwan]

@ThatWriterGuy Oh hey, welcome back!

Do you perchance have examples of your writing that you put oh so much hard work into?

[HGohwell]

Come guys, we've had the discussion about giving attention seekers what they want. Disengage and stop playing their game so they'll get bored.

On the actual topic, I agree it's very unhelpful to ever compare the two, especially trying to compare novels and artists as some people have done. They're both story telling mediums but do so are plays and tv shows and movies and animations and even just rambling out loud. They're all very different. I agree lots of artists and writers should try each other's mediums, just to get an idea of each other's struggles. A bit of walking a mile in someone else's shoes can go a long way after all. And, as the original post was trying to say, and as the topic says, it's definitely not a competition. And yes, it has to be said because as we can all see everytime it's mentioned, it goes down the road of who gets paid more and somehow that always ends up linked back to value, which is completely ridiculous anyway. Fruit pickers and bin men get paid minimum wage, but without them you're not eating fruit and your streets are full of waste, so they're pretty damn important (and should be paid more but that's a different argument).

[punkarsenic]

Come guys, we've had the discussion about giving attention seekers what they want. Disengage and stop playing their game so they'll get bored.

true... sorry

I agree lots of artists and writers should try each other's mediums, just to get an idea of each other's struggles.

yeah! when i worked in theatre, the best technicians i knew had a rule that all actors should try working in tech and all technicians should try acting / being on stage somehow, because empathy for your fellow creators (especially when youre working together regularly) is essential

Fruit pickers and bin men get paid minimum wage, but without them you're not eating fruit and your streets are full of waste, so they're pretty damn important (and should be paid more but that's a different argument).

wordddd

[SleepingPoppy]

Writer Dude getting popped:

[michaelson]

It's like the first rule of the forums...

1. There's Never a Wrong Time to be Polite
   Always be courteous to your fellow Tapas readers and creators. Don't forget that there is a real person behind every post, who, just like you, wants to be treated with respect and tolerance. Keep your cool even in the most heated discussions. Above all else, I want everyone to feel safe and welcomed in our forums. Any behavior that threatens the culture we've all helped to build will not be tolerated.
   We try our best to resolve issues behind the scenes by communicating directly with readers and creators. If you feel that there are posts that are actively hostile or are attempts to instigate any hostility, please flag those posts or get in touch with one of the moderators listed at the end.

Anyway, thanks for the reports, I've blocked and suspended the account and removed their previous posts.

[Trevor]

good grief, i saw their posts before they got deleted and i never knew it was possible for someone to get that salty over not getting an artist and then continue to be so for like a week straight.

I’m just gonna echo what was said earlier, you can’t just walk into a work place and ask for a job without a resume, you’ll be turned down. If you want free work from artists you have to generate some human capital first and write some short stories or something.

[punkarsenic]

thanks michaelson! for anyone reading back i deleted my less productive replies to ThatWriterGuy to wipe away the negativity and keep the discussion focused

[SleepingPoppy]

I'm just sad I didn't get a chance to post more duke gifs. =(

[Maps]

Just deleted mine too since I copied and pasted what they said to make points and I’m not trying to keep their posts around.

[Kittosaurus]

They were pretty fitting! I kinda want to go watch Moulin Rouge now... lol

[AllynCrowe]

hands out complementary muffins
Apologies for the writer. We're not all like that, we just like to have our efforts recognised. Novels are hard work, even if it may not look like it.

[Mari]

I don't think anyone thinks novels aren't hard work. Personally I find writing way more enjoyable than drawing, but it doesn't mean it's not a hard process, still.

[skicoak]

Why?!? Why did I miss all the excitement?!?