Binary Thinking in Storycraft, is it bad? Yes or No

On days like these, I feel great about making goofy-ahh gaming comic with my little silly jokes and my silly little tropes. People can't tell me I'm "doing it wrong" anymore bc that's the point. /srs

EDIT: I really wonder if one day someone unironically tries to approach me to tell me I'm doing it wrong bc of those things. The most I've gotten was "it's too fast for me" and yknow what I gueeeesss that's a valid concern but everyone else is good with the fast pacing so I'm leaving it like that.

I didn't look at the threads you mentioned, but I never really cared to learn about tropes because it doesn't matter (To me.), a good story is all in the execution. No trope, unless it's directly related to hate speech, is bad. To think so is dumb, and limits your possibilities.

Also personally I prefer flamboyant villains who like to be evil for the fun of it, but a sad backstory villain is good too.

I don't get what the deal is with tropes. They are fun as heck and appear naturally in the creative process.

When you want to learn about tropes, it should be in an analytical type of way. Because it's an actual part of literary analysis.

In my case, understanding tropes has helped out tremendously with my comic, thank God. A lot of it relies on parody, so being able to repeat clichés, rhetorical devices, templates, etc. (which all fall under the definition of a tropes) effectively leads to a satire that makes sense. If I did not intentionally do this, no one would understand that JumpHero is supposed to be set in a videogame-like world.

I mean look at literally pages 6 and 7 of the entire series.

6.png940x1407 375 KB

7.png940x1407 312 KB

So yeah, that's my regularly scheduled defense on tropes and what learning them actually means. Like this thread topic is saying: it's not a yes trope or no trope situation, but rather if you understand the cultural context behind them and how to use or change them properly.

I highly suggest dumpster diving through TV Tropes whenever ya'll get the chance (I think new creators definitely need to try this out). One, because that wiki is very good at clearly explaining how tropes, literary devices, and genre conventions work to the average person, but also because it's really fun, especially when you're reading about media you like. Definitely go do it (and if someone would like to go through the effort of making a page for JumpHero, I would not stop you ).

Ahhh this binary stuff can be hard, because the urge is strong to tell a creator "NO! Don't do that!" about things that don't normally work... except you know somebody made it work somewhere in very specific circumstances.

There's always this long list of caveats that make the advice feel watered down and less punchy.

Like people always say "Don't make an overpowered mary sue protagonist!" but... well, what's the most popular novel on Tapas? The Beginning After the End, which absolutely has a protagonist who is so outrageously overpowered that the story has to create challenge for him by having him choose to not use some of his abilities to hide them for political reasons, and is also so handsome that every female character he comes across is way into him and also he has a pet mini version of Toothless from HtTYD, and is so good at what he does that he replaces the teacher on his first day in class. He is... a Mary Sue, but also, The Beginning After The End is a phenomenally popular novel, far more popular than anything I've ever made.... so how could I ever, seeing that, tell somebody "don't write mary sue characters" ?

So the advice then has to become so vague that people can't follow what you're trying to tell them any more:
"Try to make a protagonist who isn't so powerful or loved that the reader can't be worried that they might lose things they care about or feel the emotional pain of disconnection from others..." and even then... there's still somebody out there who has probably broken that rule and found success.

I often tell people "Don't do some long text opening crawl about lore in your comic" But... Magical Boy starts with one, and that's a good comic! Star Wars always starts with one, The Fellowship of the Ring... Avatar the Last Airbender has an iconic one, and Undertale, of course (which itself is inspired by Zelda: The Windwaker)... So then the advice needs to be modified to:
"Don't start your comic with a long opening text crawl just because you couldn't think of how to start your story. It's a tool for very specific circumstances." which relies on a level of self-awareness and planning that the kind of person who shoves in an opening lore crawl at the start without understanding how to use one probably hasn't quite developed yet.

Ultimately, the most important thing a writer can have is experience, and advice or guidelines are just there to help get you on track before you have the experience to know why you're following those rules, or when you can break them.

Now that you're saying this, probably the best pieces of writing advice would have to be from individual reviews of each persons' work. There's no simple rule that works for everyone.

Also I love that TBATE example because I read and enjoy TBATE and you are so freaking right. And I still don't know why every female falls in love with him so quickly.

Never seen these threads, regarding tropes. I followed them when I was a kid. I was trying to be careful trying not to offend people and all that. It wasn't until Deadpool 2 that I learned that this trope stuff is stupid. Fridging I thought was this big deal and all that, but when I saw YouTuber's reactions and their explanation for why it was problematic, I began thinking for myself.

"Like wait... isn't Deadpool 2 about death and how it's indiscriminate? Weren't they like... trying to adapt the Deadpool/Death relationship in a way they couldn't sue? Weren't they trying to get meta with how Deadpool can't die? Like in the end, he just wanted to rest so he can be with his loved one, but in a way, when Cable brought him back to life it was like the studio was saying 'nah, you're just as profitable as Wolverine! If not more! We need you alive c:' and Deadpool's like "Well fine then! But I'm reviving my wife".

Also people wanted Cable's wife and daughter to be men and I'm just like "You know this happens to people in real life right?". So eventually I just stopped caring. Especially after getting into James Gunn, Suda51, and Hirohiko Araki. But that's in my own writing. And I think with my own writing (despite not caring for tropes), I am restrictive since I make sure I'm writing for my family. I also try to see what everyone thinks of my story since I think preaching to the choir would only give you so much readers.

THAT SAID, I think I'd correct a person if they're working on an established franchise I'm obsessed with. The tropes CHOSEN for series from there on out. There's been a lot of TV Shows that feel drastically different and it's frustrating. YouTubers like CinemaSins suck, but people like RLM, B-Mask, and Matthewmatosis are great when it comes to keeping certain things alive when making an adaption.

That said, I'm okay with people giving me their opinions even if they may be trolls.

More than telling people what works or doesn't work is important to understand WHY something works or doesn't, so they can "properly" break the rules in unique and creative ways.

I think people also need to remember that story craft is very subjective as well. While I have my own binary biases when it comes to story craft, it all comes down to what type of story is being written and how to tackle these things. Your story might need that villain with a backstory. A lot of new writers will eventually learn that there are some troupes that may work for a story and ignore some advice that don't fit them. That type of learning also takes a lot of time to learn that even some writers do fall into that sometimes.

Tropes exist for a reason; because people like them. People also enjoy many forms of media. They shouldn't be judged for that.

I like dark, gritty, aggressive romances. I like the idea of a big top and a smaller bottom they can just toss around. A lot of people do. And a lot of people feel that's horrifying and toxic and blah blah who gives a shit.

Hell, I've recently had someone tell me a character came off as a rapist because he literally just got close toward another character while being flirty. Didn't even touch 'em.

What's approved by the trend setters changes over time and I ain't got time myself to care. I write what I like and it seems other people like it, too, and that's all that matters.

Binary Thinking in Storycraft, is it bad? Yes or No

ಠ_ಠ

The Boys is the biggest culprit/hypocrite to this trope and I really can't take the show seriously or what the creator has to say at all. Maeve was supposed to be killed off, but the creator thought it would be cliched for the LGBTQ+ rep to die (Back then, I put Fridging up there with "Bury Your Gays"). Which okay, would be fine, but... like... the show has been indiscriminate with the people up to this point (age, sex, race, orientation). They've been criticizing stuff like this, but they went on and did it anyway? He seemed pretty passionate too. And what was crazy about that finale was that reviewers and friends I'm with were like "the ending would've been fitting for her arc, it's crazy the writers didn't pull the trigger".

I dunno, for me if a show brags about how hardcore they are with death, then they better commit. Otherwise they're all talk.

I'm sorry if I sound harsh lol. I just take this type of stuff seriously with stories whose whole selling point is "BLOOD! SEX! GORE! THIS AIN'T YOUR DADDY'S COMIC BOOK SHOW!".

The title of this topic by itself is binary thinking xD

........New thread idea, "is irony a lost art?"