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rajillustration
Jul '20

Recently got into watching sewing videos--especially with a lot of historic costumes (like Bernadette Banner1 type stuff) and it really helps to understand the construction of clothes when creating character designs. It's given not just a lot of inspiration, but also understanding of different types of corsets--who would wear them--how would they lace them--how are these sleeves made--are they lined? I never really thought much about the structure of under-clothes of clothes much, of the interlining and the way you have to use interfacing to make lapels stay at a certain angle. I never thought about stitching and how lace is applied and how people get clothes to be appealing. But now I think about it a lot as I draw. Really handy stuff, highly recommend (also sewing is very soothing to watch).

nathanKmcwilliamsIn the making of Bunneh The Rabbit
Jul '20

I definitely agree with doing motion poses instead of static ones. I get so bored with static standing poses so usually my character designs start off in motion.

AVXP
Jul '20

Sometimes I wish we used words for what they actually mean.
This is pretty much all COSTUME design and NOT character design.

Right, because that would be physical character design.
Almost ANY character can be easily picked out by their silhouettes, alone, once they are DRESSED.
The trick is draw your characters NAKED without all the extra 'hints' (capes, boots, jewelry, haircuts/color of hair, and any additional accessories). To show that you really are illustrating DIFFERENT characters with real physical differences besides the superficial.

Different CHARACTERS wearing the same costume and/or clothing should still look different.
And yep, even their silhouettes should look different.

If your character isn't naked when you're 'designing them' you're not designing a character.

IndigoShirtProd
Jul '20

I don't think that's necessarily the case. You can still account for the body of a character and any body modification (scars, tattoos, etc.) while also designing clothing.

A design tip from me is to consider doing line ups when designing a cast of characters. This way, you can see how they look next to one another. You can implement reoccurring elements if applicable and make sure no one looks too similar to one another through color, face and body shape, and clothing choices.

AVXP
Jul '20

This is the greatest reach of all time. Clothing and costumes HIDE bodily details.
If you want to have a sleeve of tats that you must show off at all times, you can design a shirt with no sleeves, have them wear a vest and/or wear a regular shirt with the sleeves rolled up.

All of those choices are COSTUME related.

clothing choices are separate from the character design.
Self-modifications are considered personality traits.

They indicate a TYPE of character, not the character.

And to be more clear, when you ADD scars to a character you are developing a backstory.
Tattoos indicate a history. All of that goes with the personality part of the design process.

nathanKmcwilliamsIn the making of Bunneh The Rabbit
Jul '20

I can see where you're coming from, but how many people actually start with drawing nude characters? Because...that's never crossed my mind to start with characters in the buff.

While I appreciate the technical correctness of your statements, I would be pretty hard pressed to separate costume design from character design.

As far as I'm concerned, all of it is integral to creating a rounded character. What's the point of separating it all?

IndigoShirtProd
Jul '20
AVXP

This is technically a contradiction. That was going to be my counter to the first part of your statement because I have a character with two sleeves of tattoos who does wear a tank top and vest that show off those those tattoos. but he also wears pants that hide the majority of his leg tattoos. But the clothing he wears strongly indicate the type of person he is. Now that's just one character in a sea of characters created by people around the world. But clothing are a very important aspect to character design(where it is applicable) And not only clothing will hide body details, hair can do that too.

I don't understand why you so vehemently want to separate clothing/costume design and character design, when the two often go hand in hand. For example, the Power Rangers. Yes, personality and backstory matter, but the main thing that separates the Power Rangers from one another are their costumes.

AVXP
Jul '20
nathanKmcwilliams

What's the point of separating it all?

You answered it already.

I appreciate the technical correctness of your statements

The reason you make a thread about TIPS is to alert people to things they don't ordinarily notice or know.
Things that are uncommon and important to help with growth for beginners and a reminder for the experienced and seasoned.

but how many people actually start with drawing nude characters?

The difference between how many do and how many should is what gives this thread value.

nathanKmcwilliamsIn the making of Bunneh The Rabbit
Jul '20

Fair enough, it is a tips thread.

I would be interested to find out, how many industry professionals do it with this method.

Regardless, it may be worth the time trying to separate the elements myself to see how much it helps. If it does...awesome. If not, at least I tried something new.

byelacey
Jul '20

I've never designed a character nude first. I always design their clothing with them, and if I decide they're going to have tattoos, scars, or whatever, I draw that separately (I'd recommend drawing any tattoos separately anyway, so you can grab and warp them onto a body to save time). Their clothing is an important part of their design for me! What they look like in their underwear? Not so important.

AVXP
Jul '20
IndigoShirtProd
1

You mean to say, the MAIN thing that separates them in their COSTUMES is the color because the suits are all so very similar. Do you notice a 'similar difference' (yes, I meant that exactly as it reads) outside the suits?

All you are saying, which is semantics ---- someone is doing their homework and watching TV at the same time.
No one has ever done that. lol
Because someone switches back and forth very quickly does not mean the two are being done at the same time or one is a direct substitute for the other.

I never said you MUST complete ONE first before switching to the other.

Iris-Grimoire
Jul '20

Why are we getting so heated over character design and it's not even about controversial stuff

Truth be told, you don't design characters naked at first. Waste of time, unless it's a bust and you haven't figured out clothes yet/ they're mostly for NSFW. Why bother without clothes when the whole is what's going to be seen in your works, when you could be working on alternate outfits?

Clothing compliments shape, compliments mood, compliments the character's personality and social standing. Color, scars, etc, all ends up being part of the outfit as well. Unless they need to run in their birthday suit for a significant amount of time, why even bother to take these essential pieces of the character away? This applies even to characters that don't have a limited wardrobe, where you'll want to make a moodboard for what they'd wear if they were a real person, they're not going to wear literally anything and look good and unique in it.

Pixels on a screen that make the serotonin go up, but when they have the clothing, attachment also go up. Nothing to get angry over.

Jenny-Toons
Jul '20

I make a lot of my character designs based on aesthetics and comparisons.

For aesthetics, I really like designs that have fluidity, so I might include flowing dresses/skirts, bell bottom jeans, or puffy shirts. But that's just clothes.

I also like a certain aura that oozes from my characters -- confidence in their poses, their actions, maybe even certain facial features that give off an air of confidence. That's kinda why I have a lot of designs with lowered eyes, maybe even sometimes combined with a smile and raised eyebrows.

For comparison, that's really based on if and when I'm doing a certain era (like say, the 70s, or the Victorian Era). Usually, I make the first design based on prior knowledge, along with the aesthetic I want. Then, I do more research, find more references, and redo that design to be a bit more accurate. I pulled this tip from Scott McCloud himself, though he uses this tip with drawing a bike before and after using a reference:

AVXP
Jul '20
Iris-Grimoire

I think you're swapping DRAWING and designing.
How can you draw an outfit on top of a character without knowing their shape first?

This is the quote that many are getting hung up on- and why? Because DRAWING costumes is where many are thinking the character creation process starts (and I bet for some, end).

No need to argue about what you believe or choose to do with your comic(s).
Soon as we start to give advice to OTHERS, we are assuming a different role.
You are not saying, this is what I do.
You are saying, these are some best practices.

If you research comic and comic art critiques, you will see how much of the feedback is about beginner artists skipping the basics and jumping ahead to do what more advanced artists do.

For instance, the problem with capes is that many artists forget to draw/outline/imagine/sketch an actual BODY under the cape. So does the word naked mean full naughty bits? lol

So should we draw the figure or the costume first?
I would hope anyone's first sketch of their character involves their general body shape as the most important thing to get going first.

No one is saying you can't make changes, but sheesh.
Characters select clothing.
Clothing does not create character.

That my tip for the character design process.
You don't have to agree.

inactive_account
Jul '20

I think there's a misunderstanding :sweat_02:

I guess most (if not every artist!) artists first draw the shape of a character/does a gesture drawing and add anatomy on top of that AND THEN draw the clothes.
I don't think that people would skip the "body shape" part and go straight into clothing, unless they are extremely experienced and take shortcuts, because they can.

So, they are designing the body of a character first, even if it only remains a loose sketch.

Iris-Grimoire
Jul '20
AVXP

By thumbnailing the character in a vague human-shape and only putting thought into it later? There's a reason it's called silhouette. First thing I want to know is how the character will be seen at a distance by someone who's never seen my comic before.

I don't really count making the anatomy sketch part of design, because I'll be doing it the first time and the umpteenth time despite fully knowing the character. That's structure. The balls and squares I'm using to block in a weapon or hat are structure, what matters is later when I refine them into a cool wing shape or an angular headdress.

EmmyPax
Jul '20

This debate is very interesting!

Just to throw another POV into the mix, when I design characters, where I start isn't very visual. I came to comics from novel writing, and so to me, the first step of the character design process is somewhat removed from any firm visual decisions. The first decisions I make that inform my characters come down to a mixture of role in the story/internal motivations vs external pressures.

For a main character, I focus a lot on what type of story I'm telling, why that person interests me, what makes them flawed and imperfect, and how they are living life in order to compensate for their flaws, but NOT fixing them. To me, the best stories usually attack the character right where they are their weakest, and the spend a lot of the first chunk of the story trying to solve the problem without engaging with their flaws, and then that moment of character arc/growth finally comes into play when the MC actually decides to change and grow.

For side characters, some of those aspects come in as well - the larger the role they play, the more likely they are to need their own narrative arc and the more likely they are to need a flaw that they're in denial about. But with side characters, they almost always play a "role" in the narrative of the MC, at least to some extent. So knowing that, what about them can be made to contrast with that prescribed role or bring them into conflict with the main character? Even with supportive friends/family, points of conflict are almost always more interesting than points of agreement.

When I do get to designing characters visually, I think I start somewhere with shape language/color theory personally, because those kind of strike the hardest and clearest fastest, then I build up details from there. Since my characters are in a realistic world and everyone changes clothes pretty often, I try to more come up with general palettes/rules for dressing my characters rather than iconic outfits. I might do it differently though, if I was writing something with superheroes or another similarly "costume" oriented piece.

In my most recent project, my main character was designed largely around circles. All her angles are very soft and even her eyes are more pronounced in a "circle" shape than all the other characters. Since I work in watercolor, there's also a particular shade of red paint I decided to only use for her hair and pretty much nothing else in the comic. All the other reds are cooler, so she stands out a little more.

In contrast, one of the other main characters is kind of all soft, sloping lines and another has much sharper features. It's fun!

spadesart
Jul '20

I think if you're designing a character for animation or comics, a 'less is more' approach is SUPER important. Sure, putting a ton of stripes and spots and jewelry and 40 separate colors works good for one of illustrations, but you're going to realize after a page or two of a comic, or after 3 frames of animation, that it just isn't sustainable. Learning how to cut back on all the 'extra' stuff while keeping designs interesting is a really important skill!

The main things I consider when optimizing my designs for repetitive drawing are shape/silhouette, the 'central' character palette- ie try to reduce the color count to under 10, and what the character's main theme/concept is. For example, if Peacock shows up again in my comic, he'll need at least a second pass of the clothing he wears, because drawing him in chapter 3 was hell.

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To start, I'd make the 'crown' feathers on his head a simpler shape that actually looks more like a peacock's crown. I'd get rid of the jacket and all the extra shit piled onto it in favor of something more form-fitting to tighten the shape of his silhouette and make his wings more visible. If I draw a trim on the new jacket, I can get away with a simple/solid undershirt without those huge buttons. The pants can keep the accents near the knees, but I'd make them smaller. So I get something like this, a little cleaner and easier to draw:

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